Buckshot Challenges Lord Jamar’s Claim That Hip Hop Is A Black Art Form

(AllHipHop News) The topic of race in Hip Hop has been an ongoing discussion since the start of the culture. In recent months, the success of Macklemore and Ryan Lewis has brought the issue back to the forefront, and one of the main individuals that has consistently criticized white rappers in Hip Hop is Lord Jamar.

[ALSO READ: Lord Jamar Speaks On The Difference Between Macklemore & Eminem]

Jamar sparked controversy last year when he made the statement that whites were “guests” in Hip Hop. The statement started a heated back-and-forth between the Brand Nubian rapper and Yelawolf. Another emcee has now provided his take on the matter.

[ALSO READ: Lord Jamar & Star Threaten Yelawolf & Call His Fans Racist]

In an interview with VladTV, Duck Down’s Buckshot challenges Jamar’s notion that Hip Hop was originally a black art form. As Vlad was asking the question, Buck interrupted to dispute the idea.

“How? How when we had Ad-Rock, a part of the Beastie Boys, in the movie Krush Groove, a part of the beginning of Hip Hop, who introduced LL Cool J to Russell Simmons?” asks Buckshot. “How was it originally a Black thing? Stop it.”

Buckshot then turns his attention to address Black people in general and states how all people, no matter their race, are simply human beings.

“I love you black people. I love you, but let me tell you something. My name is Hanif Alwin al-Sadiq. That’s my Muslim name. Yes, I speak Arabic,” adds Buck. “If you wanna challenge me, I’m the worst motherf**ker in your life, period. Ever.”

[ALSO READ: Buckshot Addresses His Argument With Hot 97′s Ebro Darden]

“The day you could bust a n***a chest open and pull out his heart, and I could see a black heart and a white heart, and know how those s**ts operate, you good. Cause until then all I see is two f**king organs that pump blood,” continues the Boot Camp Clik member. “You could sit there and tell me, ‘Yeah, but the white man was the one who did this, and the white man did that.’ The white man is gonna say, ‘The black man did this and the black man did that.’ You know what I’m saying? We can keep going on and on and on.”

417 Responses to “Buckshot Challenges Lord Jamar’s Claim That Hip Hop Is A Black Art Form”

  1. Peter Morris

    If he wants to say white rappers are guests in hip hop then he would be comfortable hearing people say black Presidents are just guests at the whitehouse. Enough with the black / white shit.

    • ZUBU

      Not only are we as Black Americans guests in the Whitehouse, but the Senate, the Supreme court, (I know we had the Honorable Thurogood Marshall as a Supreme Court Justice in fact the only brotha; cause Clarence Thomas does not count) the upper echelon of corporate america, etc. Yes whites have made great contributions to Hip Hop, great but they are essentially guests they did not invent/start this. Once again they did help considerably. Hell whites are guest in Rock N Roll, then they took over it and claim it’s theirs.

    • Casor_G

      Right! A bunch of corny hype once again. Jamar just another bitter old man making outlandish statements for pub. White folks do it all the time too

    • yesanditcounts

      Not only are we guest in the White House. White America proves it to us every day with the treatment of President Obama.

  2. Slaughtr

    I respect both these brothers they my fam but truthfully hip hop was a black youth invented genre.Before hip hop even made ground we were stuck with listening shyt like the Cars, groups like Chicago. There was nothing wrong with these white artist but it wasn’t hip hop. Black young men started the shyt period. Because white folks like ad rock , Rick Rubin (who I both respect) contributed to the artform so hip hop has no color but the core roots are black folks and that is my take. Be real about the shyt Buck but Jamar I’m sure understands white folks contribution. In my opinion if wasn’t for Rick Rubin and Russell conquering corporate America with hip hop today there is no telling if it would have survived. When you look at it the white boy provided the formula for def jam Russell had the talk game and charisma to make the record industry even further take chances on hip hop. the result a culture flamished with great history and todays bullshyt.

  3. BlaqCeeza

    Rap was birthed from the black experience. That is a fact. You can date back to early periods of rap, with the sampling of funk, disco (George Clinton & James Brown) & jazz (Duke Ellington) — these were the very foundations of rap. No one can or should deny the fact that their were great contribution by white artists throughout the history of rap music. To say that they’re “guest” is a little demeaning though.

  4. Jon

    Some black people like re writing history and say Hip Hop was a black thing. Nonsense. Just like some black people like to say Rock N Roll was a black thing too.

      • ZUBU

        @BlaqCeeza: dude above thinks Elvis, Buddy Holly, and the Beatles started Rock N Roll. LMAO……….

      • Jon

        I dont even like Elvis, bitch. But what does black people have to do with all the country western and European folk that was of great influence in the birth of Rock N Roll? Do your homework homeboy.

      • ZUBU

        Look boy that term biiitch applies to your mom, sister, aunt, wife, daughter, etc. Also please note name calling is certainly not a sign of higher intelligence. Now run on back to the trailer park and go fukk your inbred sister.
        I don’t play with kids nor child like adults, so you Buckshot and the rest of your Clan can go fukk off together.

      • Jon

        Complaining about name calling while you name call me. Not very high of you. And see the ignorance. You already took it as a fact that I am white. I’m not white and I don’t care about Elvis or the Beatles.

      • ZUBU

        Son, you are assuming that I’m assuming that you are white. I have never mentioned your race. I just told you to “run on back to the trailer park and go fukk your inbred sister.” I never called you any names, can you read? I called your sister an inbred. Are you implying that only whites live in trailer parks and fukk their inbred sisters? Because once again I never mentioned race. Now if the shoe fits then wear the MF. Now run-on you lil’ hate monger. Get, scat, shoo, etc.

      • Jon

        I’m a hate monger? I just call you a bitch which you are. But no hate over here. Nor rock N Roll or Hip Hop is purely a black thing. That’s the point.

      • anemia716

        Little Richard, a gay black man, historically is considered the GODFATHER of rock n roll. country is a variation of the blues, much like gospel has stemmed from negro spirituals developed on plantations.

        Africans have had a very very heavy influence on musical genres, from their creations to their sub genres

    • $18916246

      Buck is buggin, HIP-HOP as a culture was born of inner-city hardships, a past time created in the ghetto where blacks adjusted to these hardships i.e. wide spread poverty,crime, poor housing, poor education, and did so through artistic expression we now call HIP-HOP. Hip-HOP or it’s music was not born in the music studio, the radio, or the silver screen. These avenues were a part of what gave HIP-HOP it’s exposure and exploitation. New York ghetto’s in the early to mid 70’s were populated with blacks and latinos (Puerto Ricans mostly). And yes it was these people who are the pioneers of the culture we now call HIP-HOP. Stop all this it did not and does not matter BS. Popular American music i.e JAZZ/BLUES/ROCK/R&B/HIP-HOP music was created and cultivated by blacks historically at times when we as a people dealing with as we still do today our 2nd class citizenship here in America. I don’t blame whites for being influenced, and enjoying the culture but white people had nothing to do with creating HIP-HOP.

      • $18916246

        Name the the ghetto you live in coward, trailer parks aren’t ghetto’s, farms aren’t ghetto’s. Ghetto’s are created when financial, health, educational resources are depleted or taken away from a given city, town,. Ghetto’s are controlled by politics and business that exploit the remaining population. What then replaces communities are forced under class resident consumers who control nothing, and own very little. These are resident consumers who are then exposed to high crime, poor education, These ghetto’s become hubs for creating broken family structures, that serve to feed prison populations throughout the US and the world. DENIGGAFY yourself Jon, It’s not a black thing. Yeah, only you live in gettho as you put it, I’m dumb?

    • Brindle

      you a new fool for that one… google your history, better yet, go to a music library… you can delete you comment when your ready

    • yesanditcounts

      Rock & Roll, Jazz, Blues, Rap & Hip-Hop, Soul & R&B………all belong to black people. Shit country music is nothing but the blues watered down.

    • yesanditcounts

      Yes, we are guest to the English language. We should be speaking our native languages just like other people of color. A language older than English, but they took that away from us. Your example sounds foolish.

      • ZUBU

        @BRINDLE, @ANDRESALAZAR, @yesanditcounts: Yall spitting nothing but the truth!

      • seendadream

        obviously ur not getting my point.. how can we chastise guests in rap when we are their guests in the language we’re rapping in?

      • yesanditcounts

        I understand your premise and I mean no disrespect , I just think your comparison is short sighted. We are not guest. I guest can come and go as they please. We couldn’t. We didn’t choose this language it was force on us. Most importantly “EVERY” African American is the product of rape somewhere down their bloodlines. These movies would have you believe it was some great love affair amongst female slaves and their owners, but how is that possible when a slave couldn’t say no even if they wanted too.

    • Brooklyn Stoop

      “white people created the english language… does that mean we as blacks are guests when speaking it?”

      uh………..you never wonder why white people say speak PROPER english or wonder why when we talk its called ebonics….

      • ZUBU

        I understand what you are saying, but white Americans really do not speak proper English. The British speak proper English, hence the term the Queens/Kings English. As American, Aulstrailians, etc we speak a broken version of the English language..

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        i know that, but the guy said “white people created the english language… does that mean we as blacks are guests when speaking it?” my answer to that is yes. when we say something like conversating you hear people check you on that………..but its a issue when we check people in our ish??? strange

    • Elayorx El

      Well, it can also be stated that English is but a branch on the tree of languages, which has it’s roots firmly planted in original people’s culture.

  5. yesanditcounts

    Buckshot wants to say “How can you say that Ad-Rock was in Krush Groove?” Hip-Hop started way before Krush Groove. It started in the parks, and Ad-Rock or anybody of his race…….wasn’t there.

  6. Brindle

    Ad Rock & Krush Groove? that was a movie and a beastie boy… Come on Buck, you from NY, you know that aint the beginnings of hiphop… you can’t talk tuff and be politically correct at the same time, whats your agenda?

      • Brindle

        the truth, not emotions, not what makes you comfortable, not record sales nor rebuilding fans… just the truth… why u like the lie?

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        i dont understand your comment but this is 1000% my fault cause i didnt (“”) the comment

        i meant “whats your agenda?” (from your original comment)

        (that) is the real question………..

      • Brindle

        my agenda would be to push the truth, let history alone and quit trying to change it… younger cats have even changed the definitions of words… forget about emotions and peoples comfort zones, let the truth be what it is… that’s my agenda, kinda

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        i wasnt asking what is your agenda……….

        “Come on Buck, you from NY, you know that aint the beginnings of hiphop… you can’t talk tuff and be politically correct at the same time, whats your agenda?”

        and to your statment i was agreeing saying yeah what is (bucks) agenda.

  7. Black Jay

    I’ve been saying this from the beginning… Lord Jamar needs a couple of thick books and a bowl of collar greens. He fronts like he knows everything and in the end he straight plays himself.
    I ride with Buckshot on this. Hip Hop has become so large and so diverse that it is blatant ignorance to try to label it “Black Music”. It has now become “World Music”. Nobody can take away it’s history. But to diss a whole race and to say they are “visitors” and they didn’t have a part in it’s conception and progression is a straight lie.

    Everything can be broken down and slanted to make a point. I could say a phonograph (turntable) was created by Thomas Edison. So from that perspective it can be argued that he played a huge role in DJing and Hip Hop. It’s dumb as f*ck and oversimplifies the argument but that is exactly the type of dumb sh*t Lord Jamar puts forward. I would never try to silence the brother but sometimes he’s a f*cking embarrassment to people with brains.

      • Black Jay

        No I didn’t. Lord Jamar called White people visitors. He absolutely said that. And what was his point in saying that? We’re all visitors to planet Earth if you wanna take it there, so why state it? He meant it as a diss, that’s why. I ain’t with that f*ck sh*t….

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        do you know why the 14 amendment was put in place?

      • Black Jay

        Of course I know why it was put in place. What does that have to do with dumb ass Lord Jamar? Racism is racism. I don’t care what your skin color is.

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        so black people in this country not owning ANYTHING they create in this country is NOT racist to you? its Lord Jamar who is pointing out the obvious is…………..

        think about how crazy it would sound if paris hilton grand father who started the hilton said his hotels isnt his its for the world…………….or thomas edison or alexander gram bell said no no ………no credit here what i created is for the world. only black people think that and we wonder why we are in the state we in as a people and why our babies dont know a quarter of the inventions black people did in this country and outside of it………………

      • Black Jay

        Brother…. You’re preaching to the choir. I ain’t against nothing you’ve said. But here’s the point. Where are you? Are you back there or are you in 2014? So those people got money from the killing of my people and others. Yeah, they’re paying for those sins in hell as we speak. But if you think I’m going to be blinded by that fact and accept that as an excuse to not move my people forward, you’re wrong. It is time to elevate. Use that sh*t as a launching pad for your life. I’m not going to stand in a room and say,

        “I couldn’t get this because I didn’t have the same opportunities as the White people.”

        I’m going to say,

        You feel me? You’re not stopping my progress and distracting me over something like that. It’s game time and my child demands nothing less than the best.

      • Byron Crite

        So you keep referring to your kid for people to feel sorry for the fact that you are comfortable selling out to the white world in terms of the history of Black folks in this country?

        You have a “let’s be blind and work as hard as we can” mentality when your son could have a MUCH BETTER WORLD if the many black men who “fall victim” actually stood up and questioned the world and the tactics of those in power a lot more! I’m not saying “Lord Jamar is 100% right” I’m saying that “He has points and if more people brought things like that up more black people would have these debates and understand ownership more and we won’t have to beg a white man for a job and hope he looks past our first name… because Dequavion has a million dollar business and he only hires people he can relate too because he cares about people just as much as money”

        I think people forget sometimes that just as much as the “nigga mentality” is engrained into blacks… the “massa mentality” is engrained into whites!

      • Black Jay

        Hold on… Hold on…… Brother you’re playing yourself. “Selling out my people?” You don’t know me well enough to say something like that and the fact that you would is stupid. You have no idea of what I do day in and day out. I’m a man. I represent my family and my people to the fullest. But I’m not going to get behind Lord Jamar because he’s Black. In fact, I’m going to expect more BECAUSE HE’S BLACK. He’s in a leadership position. And leaders think before they inflict pain. Even a child can see that.

        You’ve thrown a lot of names around that I can’t support. I will just say that I hope you get the most out of life with your strategy.

      • Byron Crite

        I said selling out YOURSELF for the white world IN TERMS OF HISTORY

        Meaning you deny that blacks can “own” a culture but you will gladly take money from a white man for the job you are talking about without questioning his “ownership” of the company

        I’m saying if you have more debates… we can understand ownership more and what it means… then a guy named “Dequavion” can own a business rather than being worried about losing a job opportunity because of his name and that would benefit your son more than just a “be responsible and don’t make excuses” mentality of dealing with the world as it is without questioning it

        The problem I have is people GIVING IN because “race shouldn’t be an issue” when it IS and it NEEDS TO BE because NOT thinking about these things is why we keep falling for the same shit the natives did over 500 years ago!

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        ” But if you think I’m going to be blinded by that fact and accept that as an excuse to not move my people forward, you’re wrong. It is time to elevate. Use that sh*t as a launching pad for your life”

        thats the point, how can we move forward when things we create is not credited to us? how can we elevate when the things that can elevate us as a race is taken from us and controlled by other groups and when we speak up then its blacks thats shutting us up. there is a slew of black men and women who invented things in this country and the youth coming up now knows nothing about these invention becuse 9/10 they moms and pops didnt know. and this isnt about blaming whites………..its about black people in this country being silence on greatness but our dirty laundry is broadcast loudly in the public. if me as a black person dont know the contribution of black people in this country and only taught what OTHER RACES done then i will grow to look up to other groups and look down on my own. we are attacking lord jamar for what? cause he is pointing out the obvious. and why is it that WE have to move a certain way when it comes to white people stuff but its a problem when we hold them to that? we have to fight to break barriers and glass ceilings, all they have to do is walk in our ish and we must be inclusive…………..something is wrong with this reality we live in

      • Black Jay

        Naaah Black Man. It’s about ANTICIPATION, PLANNING, AND PROTECTION.
        The government doesn’t love Black People. If history has taught us anything it’s taught us that. But we have a responsibility to stop expecting the government to. If you create something dope (like hip hop), anticipate there will be an onslaught of people that try to take it. Plan for that.

        Russell Simmons, BET and others did a good job with selling and commercializing the idea, but they had no plan to protect it. Where are the schools? Hall of Fame? Award shows? Accurate documentation of hip hop history?

        And what can you expect if it gets used by the world? I don’t see too many black owned radio stations and tv stations that PROTECT HIP HOP. Everybody’s looking to get rich from it. When you don’t ANTICIPATE problems, or have a PLAN to control the message and it’s perception, how can you PROTECT it?

        Hip hop wasn’t taken by White People. It was given away by Black Folks. And that’s some real sh*t for your ass.

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        “Naaah Black Man. It’s about ANTICIPATION, PLANNING, AND PROTECTION”

        but isnt that basically what lord jamar is saying


      Well, I guess you are to young to remember all of the hate and disrespectful remarks that were directed at the very culture that we created!!! You need to keep your eyes and ears open, and stop acting like everything is all peaches and cream!!! Tell that “We are the world” crap to the thousands of blacks that lost their careers, publishing, and economical freedom to the hands of the white man that stole it from them!!! “LORD” is right!!! GTFOH.

      • Black Jay

        Look…. Whoever you are…. I’m not going to descend into personal attacks against you. I’m staying on subject. Bottom line… This isn’t a discussion about who created what. This is an issue of a bigot opening his mouth on sh*t he is incorrectly representing. F*ck who I make mad with this next statement but….
        Y’ALL NEED TO STOP SUPPORTING IGNORANT ASS LORD JAMAR. He uses religion and hip hop to mask his racist positions and attack innocent people.
        And if you really want to get down to it, if you’re so up on being “correct” then why aren’t you knocking BET’s front door down? Yeah it’s White owned now, but didn’t a Black man start that sh*t? They do more to hurt our people than any other television venue.
        Oh but no… That’s too deep for some of y’all. You’d rather argue about some sh*t that Lord Jamar spits, taking your eye off of real issues, and focusing on dividing folks.
        Buckshot is right. American History is painted with the blood of Black People. No argument there. But it’s 2014. I absolutely refuse to teach my son anything other than truth. My message to my son is this…

        “Be responsible for yourself son. Don’t use dumb ass excuses like “the white man did this or that” to make up for the fact that you didn’t do what you were supposed to do. Let history be a launching pad, not a f*cking crutch. Don’t forget your history, but don’t let suckas try to blind you with it either.”

        Y’all n*ggas better wake up.

      • Byron Crite

        So you gon teach your son to call himself a “nigga”? Sounds about right looking at your comments… You seem to touch on everything EXCEPT how history reflects in the world TODAY!

        (i.e. Some white people aren’t racist at all… but will they pay higher taxes from money their ancestors made off slavery to to help communities where people are still “in the dark” from the repercussions of slavery and Jim Crow?

        No… but they WILL use “personal responsibility” as an excuse be able to justify racist stereotypes to NOT have to look at what they did to lead to our demise and GLADLY run a business that cheaply exploits our community for profit they will NEVER use to give back (unless they are gentrifying the neighborhood for their friends!)

        Responsibility without excuses gets you through the door! REMEMBERING THE PAST FROM A REAL PERSPECTIVE helps keep the door open for others!

        BTW how is BET hurting blacks? Are you still living in 2004?

      • Black Jay

        Brother…. If you want to debate me, come at me like a man. Don’t come at me on personal attacks because you’re making yourself look a certain way.
        Second of all, I AM THE FATHER OF MY SON. You saw my message. I ain’t hiding or straying from anything I wrote. It is what it is.
        Finally, all of the stuff that you’re talking about means nothing if you don’t govern yourself accordingly. Lord Jamar talks all of this sh*t, but at the end of the day I’ve been to 5 “stand your ground law” protests. I’ve been to 1 “stop and frisk” protest. I give my weekends to my community on big brother tasks. I HAVE NEVER SEEN LORD JAMAR AT ANY OF THESE EVENTS. Lord Jamar is a racist dude. A divider. And my position is firm.

      • Byron Crite

        You called me a group of black people “n*ggas” didn’t you?

        My comment that you replied to wasn’t about Lord Jamar either… and I actually care about ALL black deaths so while I applaud the “Stop & Frisk” protest… I don’t care about the “white people stop killing black kids” movements when NOBODY is having a “black people stop killing MANY MORE black kids” movement!

        I don’t care if you think HE is racist! My point is that white people do have a “Christopher Columbus” mentality when it comes to things created in America! OF COURSE they have money to “buy their way” into cultures and create tools and business to market products from that culture but THAT DOESN’T AUTOMATICALLY GIVE THEM ARTISTIC OWNERSHIP OF THE CULTURE AS A WHOLE until they ARTISTICALLY do something drastic enough to change the entire direction of the culture and how we think about it!

      • Black Jay

        My brother…. You’re all over the place. What is the article about? It’s not about anything you just mentioned. It’s about Lord Jamar saying ignorant generalizing sh*t that hurts innocent people. That’s what the article is about.

        Now you have a point about “blacks killing blacks”. But that is exactly why I mentor. You have to teach and get out and affect your community in a positive way. Yeah, I care what White people think about me. But I care more about what I think of myself. And that’s my point. I’m here and now. You can either stand in a room and cry,

        “I didn’t get this because white people had the advantage.”
        or you can say,


        I’m for movement. F*ck talking about some sh*t that’s not going to move us forward.

      • Byron Crite


        I’m pretty sure the man who made $1000 dollars sucking a rich white mans dick is “moving” but at what costs?

      • Black Jay

        I didn’t get that last statement…. What was that about?

      • Byron Crite

        It’s just a point that getting ahead is one thing… but there’s always a bigger picture

        The white guy get’s a nut and the black guy made money that he needed… but symbolically it’s still the same exploitational relationship. We need more people saying “I’m not gonna suck a white man’s dick” and actually sacrificing for the greater good of our culture when it comes to Hip Hop and Black America

        i.e. A college kid sacrificing a scholarship to make a point about modern day slavery aka College Athletics
        A man sacrificing a big job at a Wall Street firm that destroyed black communities in the recession to create his own bank for people who we’re hurt and instilling the values in it that they don’t have on Wall Street

      • Black Jay

        I’m just more along the lines of…..GET IT!

        You see that corporate white dude that’s hating on you because of your color? You see that pile of money standing behind him? RUN THROUGH HIS ASS AND GET IT!
        You see that teacher telling you that you ain’t sh*t? You see that dope job behind her? PUSH HER ASS OUT OF THE WAY AND GET IT!
        You see that dude crying about how racist america is and how they didn’t give him sh*t? You see that business or degree behind him? GET IT!
        That’s what I’m about. Crying is a result of pain. But strength is a result of exercise. Do the math. Get it.

      • Byron Crite

        “You see that corporate white dude that’s hating on you because of your color? You see that pile of money standing behind him? RUN THROUGH HIS ASS AND GET IT!”

        Um that would lead to a charge and him getting his point proven which fucks it up for everyone else who looks like me for a while

      • Black Jay

        “Run Through His Ass and Get It” doesn’t mean violence black man. Come on…. Are you for real? It means don’t let that dude stop what you’re after. He’s nothing. A ghost. Every problem has a solution.

      • Byron Crite

        But that was a point about how being too confident in “their world” usually comes off as “threatening” which is one of the excuses they use to hold us back!

        I know what you’re saying…. “Don’t let that stop you or you just being what they want you to be” but I’m not in that situation….

        Im just trying to be real because people have been thinking like you since the 60s and even if one generation gets by they still found a way to use entertainment to corrupt ours…. we need to focus on our own! Maybe we get a loan from them…. but let them have the actual job and we do the same thing for ourselves 20 times better!

      • Black Jay

        Naaaah duke…. People were passive and doing what the man wanted them to do. “Good Citizens” if you will. That’s different. There’s no CLARENCE THOMAS kind of brothers over here. You don’t need to sell your soul to fight for your family and get what you want. You just need to be unfazed and strong. Racism will be here until the earth explodes. But I’ll bet you I won’t live forever. My life is too short to be whining. I got kids to feed.

      • Byron Crite

        Malcolm was Passive? Huey and the Panthers were passive? Naw they used their voices and did the same shit that hip hop is doing THE OPPOSITE OF today!

        i’m just gon leave it as this… It’s not about selling out spiritually it’s about understanding what is ours as a culture and going for the upper hand for the piece of pie we earned instead of working your hardest to hope they give you a bigger piece their pie which should be everyone’s to begin with

        Get your job and don’t whine! I feel you! But while you’re taking orders from Brett in an established company working to get a close to the top as you can without getting all the way there… Imma use my degrees to barely get by doing what I love for myself and my people and hope what my work becomes something bigger than what my competitors are doing without any respect for the people they affect… and as I make more money without having to be scared of speaking my mind… I will use my opportunities to give back as much as possible and reinvest in my community

        Some people wanna climb their pyramid which can’t be done without selling out or holding your true self back in someway… I wanna create my own and bring other disadvantaged folks in just enough to set an example and help them create their own and so on… And I actually planned for this and worked out the numbers in a business plan… it’s just up to the work and the results from now on

      • Byron Crite

        Now I feel you in a sense that “You see we are 13% of the population Well those 13 senate seats? GET IT! Those 7 governers spots? GET IT! That percentage of the wealth? GET IT Tax Reform to rebuild our communities worth the collective amount of work throughout slavery? GET IT! Then your grandkids won’t need a white man for SHIT and their kids will be coming into the cities to get educated and we will get to a point where we can use our natural appeal as black men to lead the rest of the world out of the detrimental situations caused by the same mentality that enslaved us”

      • Black Jay

        That’s what I’m saying. F*ck the complaining. Stand up. Ain’t nobody going to hand you nothing. And don’t expect them to. Take that sh*t. It’s on us as a people.

      • Byron Crite

        We on the same page as far as that but you saying GET THEIR SHIT Im saying WE NEED TO START OUR OWN AND STOP WORRYING ABOUT THEM. Understanding OWNERSHIP and their forms of MANIPULATION and discussing it is where that begins!

      • Black Jay

        Oh I cosign that to the fullest. No doubt. But Lord Jamar isn’t discussing. He’s attacking. Dialog is a two sided situation.


        Don’t you remember what happen when the BOONDOCK, made that episode. Debra put the brake on that fast. I still think you got a personal grudge against him, and that your choice. Everyman has the right to voice an opinion. Beside, don’t want your blood pressure to go up. Ha Ha. BN & Lord Jamar always kick knowledge. This is nothing new, just getting a wider audience.

      • Black Jay

        Look man…. In my eyes Lord Jamar and Rush Limbaugh are the same dude. They both say sh*t that their people want them to say and they both say some wrong stuff. And don’t come to me and say that they’re different. They’re not. They both want to blame and keep things away from the other race. But people like me want them both to shut up. Because they both represent the worst about White people and black people. F*ck both of those dudes. I choose the ultimate defender of our people. I choose God.

    • Byron Crite

      “Hip Hop has become…” destroyed your whole argument about how it STARTED…

      “White people like it now… so let’s say they started it (like a good n!gger)”


      My point is this, Black people started this, why can’t we have something. They couldn’t take R&B, FUNK. Just cause a few races enter the picture, now its all peace and love. Where all the true hip hop head at. Race will always play a part in this world. Now you never hear someone talking about how dope someone album, it’s always about sales. Hip hop died when Biggie & Tupac (RIP) past. What happen to “It’s all about reality, not about a salary”. The machine can have the new HIP POP. Us True Hip HOP head will just sit back and remember what Hip Hop use to be substance, uplifting, gangsta and just plain FUN.

      • Black Jay

        Let me tell you something homie…. White people didn’t take away hip hop. White people didn’t take sh*t. Black People gave that sh*t away. While you have all of these dudes like Jigga, Russell, Master P, and Diddy that brag about how much money they’re making, none of them thought of a plan to preserve and protect the art form. There isn’t a reputable Hip Hop Hall Of Fame, Museum, or a single radio station or tv station dedicated to controlling the legacy and message. We black people like to whine and b*tch and complain about “having” something and these dudes were so busy with commercializing it that they never thought of a plan to protect it. So please…… Cry me a river….. We can’t blame white people for sh*t. Not when you have Rick Ross, 50 Cent, Dr. Dre, Russell Simons, Jigga, Diddy and whoever the f*ck else is selling that sh*t without consideration for it’s future. You brothers have it backwards. Keep listening to Lord Jamar if you want to. He’s got y’all focused on the wrong thing.

    • Kweli

      WE need people like Lord Jamar who unapologetically expresses unpopular opinions. Tired of people kissing ass. Buckshot on some shit with that Ad Rock stuff, freakin hip hop was at least 10 years old at that point.

      • Black Jay

        At the end of the day you can believe whatever you want. But for every Lord Jamar there is a Rush Limbaugh. And I say f*ck any person that chooses to generalize and harm innocents in their desire to prove a point. You see Lord Jamar as a truth speaker. White people see Rush Limbaugh as a truth speaker. And there are those people like me, who are in the middle and just want them both to shut the f*ck up.

      • Kweli

        The Rush Limbaughs far outnumber the Lord Jamars. In some instances, you have to generalize. People do it all the time. I don’t agree with 100% of what Jamar says, but I appreciate his honesty and his refusal to backdown or backtrack in the face of criticism. That is rare these days.

  8. MrNoName2K

    Damn Buckshot can hold a good debate but real sh*t, who cares about race, good music is good music and it comes from both sides.

  9. anemia716

    i agree with buck on this, BUT as a music major in college and now audio engineer, I can tell you that nearly every, major genre of music has black roots or influences. its just truth

    Buck is merely trying to point at that people are just people and to stop associating certain genres with certain races in order to obtain some psuedo-ownership.

    • Brooklyn Stoop

      can you name something that black people created in this country and have ownership of? and thats the issue.
      when black kids grow up not knowing what black people b4 them have created because we think that what we create is for EVERYONE while EVERYONE create things AND CONTROL IT. there is a reason why there is/was a notion among black people that goes black people have to work twice as hard as white people
      and its because we cant or dont claim our accomplishments so we then look at other races accomplishments and say wow………..they must be great

      • Byron Crite

        It’s like the whole “Lets all come up together!” idea from MLK that forgets that the people in the back will come up and still be in the back!

        Our generation needs to revisit Malcolm before YMCMB destroys his legacy!

  10. majesticking

    Bottom line all sciences of life originated with the blackman the Original Man. Music Math, Language, Agriculture everything. Buck coming from Madena should know better yet it shows that he doesn’t. Caucasians have contributed to the culture of Hip Hop but just like I previously stated all sciences essence from the Original Man. FYI we do have and speak our own language its’ the oldest language known its’ called Supreme Mathematics the science of everything in life the highest life form known. Peace!

    • majesticking

      Language is a systematic means of communicating, we communicate on the highest level of life, Supreme Mathematics is the culture and Supreme Alphabets is our language, Supreme means most-high so our culture and language was fashioned by the most-high from the most-high for the most-high! Protecting Earths And Crushing Evil!

  11. Obi Won

    Glad Buck shot sees no color, but he still will be looked at like and ape with a job. I don’t agree with Jamar but it sounds like there’s a fear that the art he loves, has the potential to be “Christopher Columbused”

  12. hoeyuno

    rap as one element was always 99% black till recent years but hip hop as a whole..c’mon son!! Watch style wars! Watch wild style!! the rock steady crew which was huge in the 80s had ppls of all colors spinning on there heads…a lot of the original graffiti artists in NY were white boys…peace to buckshot..BCC!!!

      • Brooklyn Stoop

        oh yeah the real hip hop. not that crap the knee grows was making lol


      “a lot of the original graffiti artists in NY were white boys..”???

      Stop with the lies!!! The original “taggers” were black and Latino!!!

      • Byron Crite

        That was the SAME SHIT too! Black and Latino kids are always “cool” rebellious white kids and they did what we did! But since Hip Hop was just blowing up people saw “all colors” and didn’t see what it was BEFORE the cameras came in!

        The same thing is happening on a larger scale now!

      • hoeyuno

        Yup. black and Latino kids dominated..I didn’t say white boys dominated tough guy.. don’t get your panties in a knot..

  13. yesanditcounts

    The state of Hip-Hop is following the path that Jazz music took. Jazz was basically a black thing in it’s infancy. Musicians and fans were 99.9% black. Some blacks with white friends brought there white friends to the speak easys and such and sparked their interest. Soon whites where playing and performing and blacks welcomed White America in with open arms. Soon whites artists were winning awards and being considered some of the best jazz artists out. They soon commercialized jazz to the point were it’s just a shell of what it use to be……just like hip-hop is becoming. The worst part is a lot of the jazz artist who welcomed them in felt responsible for it’s demise…..just like the hip-hop artists will soon feel.

  14. ccwaterbound32

    coons are a shuckin and a jivin…black people got something called STOCKHOLM SYNDROME (look that up) your attempting to gain acceptance into a society that does not want you in the first place!!! alot of you black people taking up for white folks including this dingbat who the article is about clearly wants acceptance from those within the dominate society…you figure crumbs are better then nothing meanwhile your adversaries enjoy the whole f**king pie. hip hop is being used against us! so what if it’s accepted in damn near every household…WE’RE STILL GETTING KILLED BY NON BLACKS!!! the black community itself is spiraling downwards, and more of the black men are going to prison faster then you can snap your fingers…now watch this some fool is going to say “but what about black on black crime?” “what about women’s rights?” “turn the other cheek, forgive and forget.” and my all time favorite “that was a long time ago it’s not like that anymore.” your being mislead black people! your being bamboozled and conned into fighting other people’s causes and helping THEM advance…soon as you ask those same people to throw you a bone you get told to f**k off… just say this…im scared and i don’t know what to do about white supremacy…be real with yourselves for once! once you admit that then you can do this..learn your history, practice group economics, support your neighborhood black businesses, create a community watch/militia to protect the neighborhood and the property. so much we want to belong with everybody else instead of come together as a collective and do something to uplift ourselves….this hip hop thing means alot to a whole bunch of people…the TRUE FANS who appreciate the messages, and the corporate interests who only gives a damn about profit and nothing else… sounds like a bunch of yellow backs in here…all scared no fight left just ready to go tattle on one another like you can advance yourself somehow by cutting your own kinds throat…and when they no longer need your begging ass they sacrifice you like how scar did mufasa in lion king….are you your brother’s keeper?

      • Byron Crite

        I mispelled that my bad! I learned about that shit from “Always Sunny in Philadelphia”

      • ccwaterbound32

        nah homie i just drift from E pillar to E post just sayin my piece that’s all…corporations and other people monitor everything.

      • Byron Crite

        I wish you did man because I really wanna work with some folks on a REAL PLAN! Once you have a real feasible plan in place and get others to see it they might actually wanna work on it and won’t nothing bring black folks together like a common goal (remember the 60s?)

        One other thing you forgot though is us keeping our neighborhoods up so those of us who are smarter and make money don’t just move out and leave gangs to “lead” the impressionable kids in the community

  15. Papi Peligro

    Dumb argument. Lord Jammar Bill Oreilly dude that ain’t black people. We say what we mean clear. We don’t half step. He need to get off that coke. Who cares.Black were doing an Irish Jig. Bojangles dance moves was Irish. James Brown got’em from. Michael Jackson Prince Got’em from. Usher Got’em from.

      • Papi Peligro

        Alright dummy. The style of writing in hiphop is a poetic limerick. Limericks are Irish.

      • ccwaterbound32

        so? but we made it better and to suit OUR PURPOSES it still doesn’t change the fact that the BREAK BEAT was originated at 1520 sedgewick ave in the bronx NY! so your point is immediately DEBUNKED….

      • Papi Peligro

        Aight you stilll didn’t make rapping. You didn’t make rapping to a beat. Its like trap rappers saying they made the trap. Dumb argument.

      • ccwaterbound32

        so irishman were rapping their poems? is that the argument? pull up a video in the late 70’s early 80’s showing an irish guy rapping and maybe just MAYBE i’ll believe you….

      • Papi Peligro

        Blondie. Teena Marie. Anyway. All you did was take Gil Scott Herons stuff and put it to Disco music.

      • Papi Peligro

        Ancient African poems don’t follow rythmic pattern found in Hiphop. Found in rap.

      • Byron Crite

        Things change over time just like African music changed to Negro Spirituals and it changed to Gospel then The Blues!

        And the dances we do to the beats are purely African!


      Apparently you don’t know a thing about black culture??? Bill “Bojangles” Robinson was just one dancer, so what about the many others??? This is a black culture(HIP HOP) that came from the streets, and that’s it!!!

      • Papi Peligro

        Bojangles danced the soft shoe. What do you think the soft shoe came from. You don’t know Bill Bo Jangles Robinson. Why do you think Hammer dance look just like River Dance. Man you cats is blind. You want so bad to be equal you try to find superiority. You not legitimize as a race because someone founded hiphop.


        Like I said before you don’t know shit about black culture or history!!! You are referring to one entertainer, but you don’t know shit about the hundreds of others who were popular because of their style of dance. “Bojangles” was a tap dancer, and yes it resembled what the Irish called a “JIG”, but it was more to him and his dance style, and there is more to Hip Hop. Every time something comes out of our culture people like you try so hard to change the actual history of it!!! You know what is with your way of thinking and attitude!!!

        “Why do you think Hammer dance look just like River Dance”???

        There are and were many other forms of dance that resembles what African Americans do now and use to do!!! Many African dances resemble dances that are done today, so what’s your point??? You missed me with that bullschitt you posted!!!

    • Pirate7X

      That Irish jig was founded centuries earlier in Azania (South Africa) with Zulu dance specially gum-boot dances. And I’m sure you probably know Ireland like most of Europe was founded by African Moors.

      I agree that Lord Jamar is going a bit far but he has some points.

      • Papi Peligro

        It didn’t get to the americas that way. Specifically the soft shoe dances were Irish. Thats what he danced. So like dude said you can go back say this white dude this this black dude did that. We talking about hiphop it didn’t come from the streets you think it did.

      • SBRon

        Usually, the only way I can get the unenlightened to understand these things is to mention “Othello”….sometimes even that’s over their heads!!

  16. jball8

    If hip hop remained underground and didn’t sell its integrity to (white) corporations, it would have been easier to keep white people out of it. It went commercial which means the doors were opened for everyone as rappers and listeners. White listeners made black rappers rich because they bought more albums than black people. That’s because they are a higher percentage of the population. If your bread and butter as a rapper comes from white people, you can’t check them at the door and say they have no place. Our generation now has white people that have listened to hip hop their entire lives and will most likely pass the music down to their children. Hip Hop is sewn into American culture just as much as the stars and stripes.

    • Pirate7X

      Agreed though him and Lord Jamar have points. There is a concerted effort to whitewash this Black & Latino founded, created & cultivated culture. The art was born by us but the white powers that be have an interest in promoting artists and images that are more palatable to themselves, their families and communities.

      It’s personal and business. It is not by chance that no Black male artist topped the charts in 2013 as long as Macklemore, Robin Thicke or Justin Timberlake. Or that Justin was given near legendary MJ treatment at the VMA’s for 10 years of hits to Usher’s 20 years.

      The mainstream is for everybody and Rap musicis part of that, a major part. The problem is corporate & mainstream interests in excluding the community and artists that founded it for a white supremacist image.

      • Byron Crite

        That’s why Timbo and Pharrell and now Mike Will all try to find white artist (JT Robin and Miley) because they knew you make more money even though they aren’t as talented…

        Also sadly it will never be popular to be socially conscious again since these artist who could speak up for the struggling black boys are more worried about the rich white boys who actually buy their albums… The only way things will change is if there is a new form of “street” music that actually “knows better” from the start and learned the lessons of Jazz… Rock & Roll… R&B… and now Hip Hop

        I’m surprised you didn’t mention how they are trying to turn Justin Bieber into one now so we’ll have another white guy getting the best beats and best songwriters and taking money out the hands of people who need it and deserve it the most

    • Byron Crite

      Which is exactly why when whites starting listening to hip hop… black artists (especially here in the south) turned it into a minstrel show where we wear our own black face… and on top of that the white people who run the major labels and go to dinner parties with other rich white conservative Republicans knew of the bigger plan to make sure these stereotypical images of people living like ignorant sociopathic narcissistic materialistic “thugs” are being pumped onto the screens of impressionable black kids in broken homes with no opportunities to use entertainment and our need for attention to “train us” to “know our place” and only live up to being “n!ggers”

  17. Pirate7X

    Buck is defending his close personal and business relationships with whites i.e. Dru Ha. He’s being honest but I’m sure there’s more to it being his in close with white folks for business (possibly the co-founders of his shoe brand Triple Threat).


    “BUCK”, then who in the f*** started this thing called “Hip Hop”??? I am a fan of “BCC’, but this cat lost his mind!!!


    I am tripping off of some of these comments on here!!! Any time something great comes out of the “black culture”, you have whites, Latinos, and even some ignorant blacks that try to change the history of it!!! 20 years from now, they will teach in some of these courses that a blond hair Caucasian from Detroit was the architect behind the birth of “HIP HOP”!!! And people will believe it. It’s truly hard for some to believe the accomplishments of African Americans and other black people, period!!!

  20. hitmhard313

    I’m sorry Buck shot does not know shit about what he’s talking about and the sad thing about it is you would think that he would be able to spit that truth that OG’s suppose to know.Every time black’s invent anything that effects the world it get’s claimed by another race as their own look at Rock N Roll look at Jazz Blues look at gospel. You can’t name 1 Rock N Roll group that’s out now and black are the one’s who invented that form of music. That’s just music blacks have patented so many invention’s that changed the world as we know but that history is never told. Hip hop is go be one of those culture’s 50-100 years from now black’s aren’t go be a part of because we don’t control it.

    • Chrisblackusa

      the only time it was controlled by hiphoppers themselves was in the mixtape cassette days before record deals,,

    • SBRon

      We’ve never united to “control” anything (positive)!! Can’t blame someone who’s name ends with “berg” for that…it’s on US!!!

  21. namnudda

    Hip hop is a art form..not a peron..why do we always have a to put a color to something..pure ignorance..buckshot was on point..music was created for everyone to enjoy ,anyone with the ability to listen.

    • Byron Crite

      Because that art form relates to an actual culture in a country that was founded of manipulation of the idea of “ownership”

  22. Opposite Of Everyone

    the argument is infantile – i’m sure that white people had a hand in inventing something without which there wouldn’t be hip-hop as we know it… now i don’t know who invents stuff but i’m pretty sure a white guy must’ve invented(or had a hand in inventing) either one or more of the following – electricity, radio transmitters, turntables, microphones, sampler. aerosol cans, marker pens, sneakers or the english language. and it is arguable that each of these things were in some way necessary for hip-hop culture to exist in the form it took;

    • Brooklyn Stoop

      “now i honestly don’t know who invents stuff”

      its better to be thought a fool then to sound like one

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        we’re all ignorant of something. I prefer not to fill my mind with information that carries no value eg. peoples name/ethnicity.. unprocessed information leads to Alzheimers.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        powerful retort! i see what you did there…

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        I simply finished your Captain Obvious statement letting us all know that you are ignorant. It is best to shut up when you don’t know what you are talking about. It’s ancient knowledge since it’s obviously not common to you… See what I did there? Common… Common Sense… Ancient Knowledge… Time… comprehension… nothing new under the sun. Yeah, I figured you’d grasp it.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        you might want to read that back to yourself sunshine…

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        Nawll you might want to read it slower nightlight…

    • ccwaterbound32

      yeah? so lets say hypothetically speaking…if blacks never used any of those things to create hip hop the 4 elements of it breakdancing, grafitti, MC’ing and D Jaying, would whites have crafted those concepts all on their own?… and i really would like a response too…let’s see how your going to spin this…

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        The same actually couldn’t be said vice versa. When you take the stance that Hip Hop is NOT a black art form then you simply don’t know the history of the culture. Without African Americans there is no Jazz, Hip Hop or any of the music that was birthed from their experiences. If NYC want to be created with birthing Hip Hop then they should also take responsibility for allowing Hip Hop to be invaded and exploited by those outside of the culture.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        no-one’s taking any such stance bruv, relax…

        however, seeing as you mention it, without Europeans there’d be no Jazz either; it’s a fusion of African rhythms and scales and European harmonic progressions…

        arguments over which human phenotype created which human cultural phenomenon are futile. humans are apes. Apes evolved from other creatures and you can take it right back to single-celled amoeba (unless you believe in Bronze Age mumbo jumbo that is).

        No one invented hip-hop; it isn’t an invention.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        Once again, you sound like a fool. Your mind can’t move beyond anything being created without European interference. The European harmonic progression was added after the fact. You know damn well that the term “European Harmonic” doesn’t even make sense lol! Is it the same type of European Harmonic Progression that is heard in Country? Heavy Metal? Let me know lol!

        “arguments over which human phenotype created which human cultural phenomenon are futile.” Yet you decided to open up your response by saying “without Europeans there’d be no Jazz.”

        Hip Hop isn’t an invention it is a creation that evolved from the cultures of Blacks Africans of the diaspora.

        Why didn’t Jazz and Hip Hop appear in Europeans areas, first?

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        And your mind can’t move beyond the idea that black people created hip-hop in a vacuum without white influence… sheeeiiit..

        Hip-hop was created by black people under the influence of living in a white-governed country; therefore white people indirectly influenced it..

        BTW, by ‘european harmonic progressions’ i was referring to theuse of specific tonal systems/scales (major, minor, diminished, chromatic scales) in Jazz. Prior to the fusion of african and european culture in America (via slave trade); african music used pentatonic scales. Pentatonic scales will give you a basic blues but not the kind of extended chord progressions we get within Jazz that are essentially based on the European Classical tradition. In fact many Jazz standards were ‘plays’ or versions of european songs (folk and popular). The rhythmic syncopation, phrasing and to a large extent the structure (in particular Blues) indeed comes from African traditions but the scales are from other cultures (apart from Pentatonic which is also found in Asian culture)

        Make no mistake, I know hip-hop, jazz, soul, funk etc are all forms of black music, pioneered and created by black people; however there is logically going to be a white influence on all music created in white-governed lands; even if it’s a negative influence.
        Otherwise the music of African-Americans would probably sound the same as the traditional music of Ghana and Nigeria.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        “And your mind can’t move beyond the idea that black people could create in a vacuum without white influence… sheeeiiit..” <— There's thousands upon thousands of years of documented history proving this. Before there were a such thing as a European there was Black History. The facts are as simple as that.

        "Hip-hop was created by black people under the influence of living in a white-governed country; therefore white people indirectly influenced it.." <— So that mean whatever Jews created while in Germany should be created by the Germans? Yeah, keep exposing yourself.

        Why wasn't Jazz or Hip Hop discovered in European areas before appearing in the Black areas is the question lol! See, you can side step all day but you are lacking facts. Who was the first European Jazz star?

        Listen to J.Coles "Can't Get Enough" You're dumd ass probably think that he sampled that from a spanish song lol! He actually sampled it from a group in… YES YOU GUESSED IT… WEST AFRICA. The track is Paulette, is by Balla et ses Balladins , one of the most creative – but now mostly forgotten – bands to have emerged from the small West African country of Guinea's golden golden era of music.

        Name something of importance that you hear in Hip Hop outside of self hate and ignorance that came from a European influence?

        You probably think that John Wayne, Elvis, and Frank Sinatra got their styles from other Europeans lol! Ole Blues eyes was nothing more than a white washed Duke Ellington. Get your history up… it's just too easy LOL!

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        you’re not thinking straight fam….

        whatever Jews created would’ve been influenced by what was around them yes; that includes plants, insects, buildings, technology and yes Germans, Would the Jewish history be the same without Germans holocausting them? No! so that’s an influence then; despite the fact it’s a negative one; it’s still an influence.

        It can be evidenced that creativity is born out of oppression. In that sense it could be argued that without the influence of the oppressors the art would’ve been different – eg. there might not have been any Blues if black people weren’t feeling Blue at their hideous plight at the hands of crackers…. get it?

        Influence is not something that necessarily needs credit assigning to it; environment is an influence on creation.

        peace brother.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        “Influence is not something that necessarily needs credit assigning to it; environment is an influence on creation.” <— So STFU then lol! You are just posting to post. You can't give Europeans credit of Black Art just like you can't give the Germans credit for Jewish art. You still ain't listed no actually facts. Where's the list that I asked for after you double dared me to test you 40 years of hip hop knowledge? That's the topic at hand… not your articulation of a topic that you have already claimed to have limited knowledge about o in one breath and supreme knowledge in the very next smh.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        if you read my ish accurately you’d have seen i said i don’t know much about who invents stuff (eg. electricity, aerosol cans etc). I do happen to have a large knowledge of hip-hop though; it is what it is…

        But, and I’m not sure how you keep misinterpreting this; my argument (from post 1) is merely that there must’ve been a white influence on hip-hop in some form considering the environment and technology..

        I made no mention of credit or creation; just logical acceptance of the influence of ‘other’; in fact furthermore, many black people who created hip-hop could reasonably have had some white blood forcibly inserted into their genepool at some point down the lineage.

        and as for your list, I could probably name about 5 (max) white people who’ve had an important direct influence on the culture; from within the culture. However, forces external to the culture can and have still helped shape it. eg. Government policy, Reaganomics, the Bronx expressway; along with which ever of that initial list of products I wrote was invented by white people (if any); each of them had an influence. And there’s no way of knowing what hip-hop would be (better, worse, completely different) if it wasn’t for these influences.

        I think it’s important for black people to want take ownership of the art form for a number of reasons; but technically speaking, the outside influence is clearly evidential..

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        “there must’ve been a white influence on hip-hop in some form considering the environment and technology..” <— Name it and prove it. The fact that you feel like it couldn't exist without an European Influences proves that you are the idiot. I mean, damn, if that was my position I would be stating facts left and right to shed light on my position.

        "in fact furthermore, many black people who created hip-hop could reasonably have had some white blood forcibly inserted into their genepool at some point down the lineage." <— There have been Presidents that have been said to have black in them but it would be stupid to say that they were influenced by "blackness deriving from their black DNA lol!

        "And there's no way of knowing what hip-hop would be (better, worse, completely different) if it wasn't for these influences."<— Nothing that you named have anything to do with Hip Hop today. Whites had what Blacks had and more yet Hip Hop wasn't in the European areas b/c it was foreign to them.

        "but technically speaking, the outside influence is clearly evidential.." <— Technically speaking All things Human are derived from Africa so you still have no point.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        i just named some. Reaganomics, Cross-bronx expressway, the influence of white oppressors creating/engineering the ghetto environment and poverty that birthed the culture… and whic hever whites invented those products, do you want me to google that for you?

        technically speaking the universe was not derived from Africa, so your statement is somewhat erroneous. It is evidenced that humans derived from Africa but that’s merely one species of millions on earth… did all species derive from Africa? And if not, what’s so important about humans or indeed Earth in the grand scheme of things eh?

        And didn’t Africa used to be connected to europe and asia as one land mass? Was it still Africa then?

        The earth is small enough as it is without making further divisions. just because there happens to be some water separating 2 landmasses.

        As for the gene pool argument; i think you may be unclear on the definition of the word ‘influence’.

        “Nationalism is an infantile disease” (Albert Einstein)

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        “i just named some. Reaganomics, Cross-bronx expressway, the influence of white oppressors creating/engineering the ghetto environment and poverty that birthed the culture” <—- So you really think that blacks don't create the culture of Hip Hop without those? You make no sense. Non of those mentioned factors made Afrika Bambaataa and others say "this is why we should create our own culture" lol! Blacks have created music and culture from day one pre-dating European influence.

        HUMANKIND WAS CREATED IN AFRICA so judging by your logic I am absolutely correct.

        "did all species derive from Africa? And if not, what's so important about humans or indeed Earth in the grand scheme of things eh?" <— The species that we are from ABSOLUTELY derived FROM AFRICA. However, if you are European you are mixed with Neanderthals… which is another topic. BUT since ALL HUMANS today came from the Mitochondrial Eve (which refers to the matrilineal most recent common ancestor of all currently living anatomically modern humans, who is estimated to have lived approximately 100,000–200,000 years ago in Africa) I'm pretty sure that all modern Humans came from Africa which makes your entire argument invalid.

        "And didn't African used to be connected to europe and asia as one land mass? Was it still Africa then?" <— Connected or not it is common knowledge that ALL HUMANS came from the part of land that is called Africa today. The middle east was actually considered to be apart of Africa at one time so that includes the the Fertile Crescent include Mesopotamia, the land in and around the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. Beyond all of that, recessive genes are genes that are not dominant (they are weaker genes that came from their dominant counterpart, but only manifests when a gene of both parents is the same, i.e., homozygous (where bothgenes are the same as in two genes for blue eyes).

        DNA proves who came first so it simply can't be debated no matter the amount of palaver you try to cover the facts with.

        The ignorant call it division when they get exposed b/c they are too stupid to grasp the term "pluralism." it's cool, you can google it… I mean hell, I've been putting you up on all this game for free anyway lol!

        Nationalism? lol! Once again, when you attempt to be knowledgable about something that you don't have a clue about then you simply start posting anything with hopes that something makes sense. I mean, what's next tribalism b/c Hip Hop is surely not about Nationalism lol!

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        “So you really think that blacks don’t create the culture of Hip Hop without those? ” well without the South Bronx environment who knows how hip-hop would’ve come about.

        I absolutely believe the evidence that modern humans came from Africa (even though I didn’t carry out the research myself)… The current thinking (from some quarters) is the 3 species theory of Neanderthals (predating modern humans), Mongoloids (Asian) and Cromagnon (modern human aka black). Theories also abound that all white people have upto 4% Neaderthal in their genes…but I’m not arguing with that, I’m saying the concept of Africans being the first humans is only important if you percieve humans as important in the first place or indeed more important than all the other species that came before them. And if white people are actually part-Neaderthal, then they’re not ‘all-human’ which means there’s no point comparing the 2 as they’re not even entirely the same species !

        And as for “Connected or not it is common knowledge that ALL HUMANS came from the part of land that is called Africa today” – didn’t you hear Rakim say “it ain’t where you’re from, it’s where you’re at”?

        Nationalism was brought up as you appear to be in favour of discerning insignificant differences between humans; a characteristic trait of Nationalists and fascists alike…

        the fact that a particular species came from a particular vicinity of land on earth means what precisely? What value can be logically or meaningfully attached to that?

        Humans derived from earth; granted. but why is the particular place on earth they derived from of significance to you other than for political reasons? Humans are merely part of a chain of events that didn’t begin on earth or even in this galaxy…(neither will they end here)
        Perhaps a wider perspective might help with your anthropocentricism…

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        “”So you really think that blacks don’t create the culture of Hip Hop without those? ” well without the South Bronx environment who knows how hip-hop would’ve come about.” <— You sound like the same person that thinks that the Harlem Renaissance actually started in Harlem lol!

        Neanderthals (predating modern humans) <— Yes they did but they were not the same as the modern human and sexing them back then is like sexing other animals today.

        "but I'm not arguing with that, I'm saying the concept of Africans being the first humans is only important if you percieve humans as important in the first place" <— We are talking about influence and if you can call upon South Bronx environment then I can call upon the original man, the Hue Man who came from Africa and gave birth to all modern day humans and human creations.

        "didn't you hear Rakim say "it ain't where you're from, it's where you're at"?" <— Didn't you hear Malcolm X say ""You Can't Hate The Roots Of A Tree, And Not Hate The Tree"?

        Nationalism was brought up as you appear to be in favour of discerning insignificant differences between humans; a characteristic trait of Nationalists and fascists alike… <— Learn the definitions of the words that you want to use before using them b/c the term Nationalism is actually defined as — the policy or doctrine of asserting the interests of one's own nation viewed as separate from the interests of other nations or the common interests of all nations. As you can see, your definition isn't even close to being correct lol!

        the fact that a particular species came from a particular vicinity of land on earth means what precisely? What value can be logically or meaningfully attached to that? <— If the first human was found in Asia then it would mean that all modern humans have been influenced by their native Asian environment to get to where they are now. ALL human culture and history was influenced by the original man that was influenced by his naturally environment which was Africa. I'm just using the same logic that you tried to use but seem to be backpedaling from now since it no longer supports your ignorance.

        "Humans derived from earth" <— No humans derived from a place on earth that is known today as Africa. The Atlantic Ocean is also a part of earth but we know that humans didn't come from there.

        "but why is the particular place on earth they derived from of significance to you other than for political reasons?" Your initial point is that b/c blacks created music in America then white people must have had a influence on it and if that is true then all Humans were have been influence from Africans from Africa since that is the genesis since it was first.

        One one hand you claim that "Hip Hop would not have been what it is today b/c of the South Bronx Environment" yet on the other hand, you don't want to admit that all things HUMAN derived from Africa since that is were it all begun.

        Maybe you should read a book since you have flipped flopped from saying ""now i honestly don't know who invents stuff"" then saying "i'm sure that white people had a hand in inventing something without which there wouldn't be hip-hop as we know it" LOL!

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        “You sound like the same person that thinks that the Harlem Renaissance actually started in Harlem lol!”

        *regardless who i sound like, it doesn’t disprove the point.

        “Yes they did but they were not the same as the modern human and sexing them back then is like sexing other animals today.”

        *so modern humans (blacks) were into bestiality back then?

        “the Hue Man who came from Africa and gave birth to all modern day humans and human creations.”

        * the term ‘hue man’ is not the etymological root of the word human and is basically a crude pun.

        * my usage of the word Nationalism was entirely in keeping with your quoted definition, thanks.

        ” ALL human culture and history was influenced by the original man that was influenced by his naturally environment which was Africa.”

        *that doesn’t mean human culture wasn’t also influenced by other cultures, factors, species etc

        “humans derived from a place on earth that is known today as Africa.”

        *which is on Earth (a tiny speck in the universe).. the exact geographical location is arbitrary. do you care which part of earth amoebas first appeared? if not you’re merely being anthropocentric.

        “Your initial point is that b/c blacks created music in America then white people must have had a influence on it and if that is true then all Humans were have been influence from Africans from Africa since that is the genesis since it was first”.

        *that’s right; and later on neanderthals/white people influenced them back! an exchange of influence (whether mutual or forced). The concept of ‘I was first’ is generically infantile which was my initial point and the whole essence of why I posted.

        Humans derived from africa but if whites aren’t human then that’s wouldn’t be important to them as they are a separate species! Just like you’re probably not concerned with where on earth Lobsters first originated!

        At the end of the day (and this will be my last post as I’m bout to go out I’m afraid) humans and part-neanderthals have influenced and will continue to influence each other.

        there is no way of proving that if black people never came across white people there would be hip-hop as we know it but there are clear indicators that the culture was influenced for better or worse by white culture; namely American-europeans in NY.

        Personally i don’t think it’s important as i’m perhaps not as human-centric as you and tend to look upon humans as a rather unfortunate variant of primate that has all but ruined the planet which is nothing much to be proud of.

        Knowing that black people were the first humans and that they were first in Africa has as much value as knowing which was the first species of bird, insect or plant – interesting bit of trivia but that about it…

        and furthermore if we do accept the idea that whites aren’t actually human then there really is no argument to be had as they are 2 different species

        Peace judge.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        Where was Music discovered? When was it created? Yeah in Africa where all Humans come from. Just like you claim that Hip Hop wouldn’t be Hip Hop w/o the South Bronx, Music wouldn’t be music if it wasn’t for Africa. Same logic, you are simply too stupid to see it.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        First off there is know “WE.” I simply said that Europeans have non human DNA which is a fact proven by Science. Science, Math, language and all other elements that make humans unique all started in Africa aka the birth place of Human life. It’s not my fault that you can’t prove your point with facts.

      • Elayorx El

        You came back nice here, as I see clearer where your going with this, as hard as it would be for many to stomach, technically, we can say Hip-Hop is an indirect product of “Black” oppression here in this country. But semantics may be involved somewhat, where one may say, “whites were involved in Hip-Hop’s birth”, which would be correct, but then we would need specifics, especially if we are to use history as a benchmark. Good stuff.

      • ccwaterbound32

        in other words your saying due to the negative treatment of blacks in the U.S they have helped to cultivate the music due to their constant tactics of white supremacy? DO TELL….

      • Elayorx El

        European harmonic progressions? I’m sorry opposite, but “harmonic progressions” have existed from time immemorial. We have actually been “scaled” back since the rise of Eurocentrism. If no one “invented” Hip-Hop, Einstein doesn’t have a theory of relativity either, which arguably, he might not have anyway. Come on fam. Respect.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        incorrect I’m afraid. purely or traditional African and Asian music forms are invariably harmonically static in as much as they are not teleological. Rather they are repetitive and rely onrhythm, flow and rupture as primary modes of impetus; unlike european classical traditions in which harmony and melody are the primary parameters; usually at the expense of rhythmic interest.
        And when exactly did ‘time immemorial’ start bruv?

      • ccwaterbound32

        the same impoverished conditions of the south bronx were in eastern europe and russia so you mean to tell me that those europeans couldn’t have constructed hip hop? your just deflecting hoping to hit something but in actuality your missing every single shot you fire.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        i’m not saying white invented or created hip-hop sunshine. just that they influenced it, at the very least by creating the ghetto it was formed in.

      • Elayorx El

        Now when it comes to moving, and speaking to my spirit, which is the yardstick I go by, I’m not sure how those words really apply, if they ever even did to my Ancestors, and “time immemorial” is exactly what it means. From a “beginning” that is practical, that we can point to, now. Our sounds don’t have parameters, which is the primary issue here, whereby European “measurement” is unable to make a sound determination due to this fact. Rhythmic interest? Really?

      • Elayorx El

        Interesting, as that was my initial feeling regarding your post, but I made do regardless. Partake again, and make do, regardless.

      • Immortal

        El, hope you’re doing good bruh. I would say that Hip Hop isn’t an invention because that would give ownership to one, or one group over another. Hip Hop is an evolution. You have the old slave hyms that looked at blindly have no meaning, but when analyzed have soo much to offer the mind, then it continues to move forward into ragtime, rock and roll, and onto Hip Hop. Hip Hop is owned only by the feelings of those that can make the message, and those that can understand the message. That’s why there is rap (wrap) in my mind, where there isn’t always a point, a meaning, or an actual message. Just get out there and say anything over a good beat or hook. Hip Hop is a belief, a lifestyle, the elements, and anyone can share any of them or not have any of them. I believe in it’s evolution because there slaves weren’t just black, we’re just the most dominant race used. But to say there were no Latino’s would be wrong, same with the Indians. Feelings were taken made and vocally put out…..same message of freedom, suffering, and triumph. No one owns them, but damn near everyone can relate to them.

      • Elayorx El

        Immortal, what it be like fam? I totally agree, and when the rest of the free world can grasp even a gram of that perspective, this will be a much better place to call home. Unfortunately, insidious tricksters lurk at every potential point of interest, and it is up to those qualified to at least be able to identify this to those too innocent to know, thus stemming the tide of perpetual exploitation, and ignorance. One L…..

      • ccwaterbound32

        you do know the harp was invented in africa right? all they did in europe was turn it on it’s side and encased it in wood and used keys to create a different sound… sorry WE made those instruments REAL music didn’t come about until WE started playing with those instruments…

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        what are you 16? your post reminds me of what we were like in around 88 when P.E and X Clan came out; militant without any sense of objectivity or wider perspective…
        don’t worry brother, time is a great teacher..

      • Isaac Hayes

        Shut up Hippie I’m a proud angry Black man who is 41 you must be one of those smart dumb n*gg@$ trying to be brolic miss me with that bullsh*t. Thanks for the shout out to one of many great rap groups from the 80’s

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        still a young un then.. fear not, time is a great teacher brother.

      • Byron Crite

        Just like they created the dance moves on their own!

    • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

      If I created rubber can I take parcel credit for Dale Earnhardt Jr’s Daytona 500 win? Exactly, that’s how crazy you sound right now. Besides, it’s common knowledge that a lot of the creations in America where actually created by blacks who were not allowed to take credit for their own creations — actually most of American history has been white washed to make it appear that one side were the creators while the others were deemed incapable.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        well if you’re gonna say that black people invented all those things then I’m not going to argue with you… but are you sure?

        it is pointless to argue over who invented hip-hop when it’s not an invention

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        It’s actually pointless to speak on topics that you clearly don’t know anything about.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        bruv – i double dare you to challenge me on knowledge of hip-hop culture or hip hop music of the last 40 years! I’ve lived and breathed through all eras of this ish son and then some! bring it the ufck on.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        I actually only respond to triple dares but if you insist, “bruV.” List the contributions of whites and blacks in the last 40 years of Hip Hop and it will be clear to you that Hip Hop was birthed and is rooted within American American Culture. Don’t get shook… post the list.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        that’s a no brainer that requires zero knowledge of the culture.

        do you really know your hip-hop fam?

        surely the term ‘African-American’ is evidence of the fusion?

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        So my point is proved. Hip Hop is a Black Art form created from blacks which evolved to the world. But since it is so easy to answer coupled with that high and mighty double dare that you extended, I am still waiting on a list… not a piss poor attempt to side step.

      • Judah Nazayar

        yes, two white men. whose names are now on everybody who live/lived on that continent

  23. RichFromBX

    it’s funny how many people are blaming white people and the white corporations for the state of hiphop today – blame whitey all you want but they couldn’t buy hiphop if there was a nigga willing to sell it out…

    • ccwaterbound32

      true and ill say this…they sold out because they wanted to be apart of the dominate society’s little community…

      • Sean Taylor

        No they sold out for $ so they could live well and take care of their families for generations to come…..

      • Judah Nazayar

        the bigger joke is on them. When the Govt introduces the microchip.. Their wont be any wealth. Itll be even more apparent that people r mindcontrolled zombies. Money will be digital… Fully. No precious metal, No fake fed reserve note not backed by gold. No nothing=slave!!!!!! working for free.

    • Byron Crite

      Exactly! But there will ALWAYS be a nigga ready to sell out! You can’t be mad that someone WHO DOESN’T KNOW ANY BETTER taking money to feed their kids not knowing they are being turned into a minstrel show

      But YOU CAN blame the smarter person who manipulated and took advantage of them!

      If there are 50 kids and 49 of them know better…. all it takes is THAT ONE to take a million dollar deal to act like a monkey to get 49 other kids around the world to think “Acting like Monkey = Money/Respect/Shiny Accessories/Girls” especially when you take jobs away and defund schools in the process!

  24. Asher "Black Bomb" Sommer

    Hip-Hop was birthed by the people who attended Kool Herc’s Parties in the Bronx.

    But AHH pls embed the video to do Buckshot right.

    If you show Lord Jamar here Buck should have equal rights.

    Buck just made a pint that he is about peace between all races

    appreciate that. And we black people should not always be mad

    at the world.

    Of course we should not forget all modern music was created by
    Black people in the hood. Rap, House, Jazz, Rock n Roll, Reggae,
    Jazz, Blues, Funk,. And how many times white ppl came in and
    went with it? So I can also understand Lord Jamar.
    The answer is. We need to make better music and stop supporting

    • Brooklyn Stoop

      so we’re supposed to make better music……………for them to control it, water it down then take control of it and when we point this out (lord jamar) then we attack him.

  25. SBRon

    Yeah, and Elvis is the “King of Rock n’ Roll”…15 years ago, people laughed at me when I said a few decades down the line, Marshall Mathers will be known as the “King of Hip-Hop”!!

  26. Byron Crite

    If you really don’t understand why race is an issue…. let me break it down:

    – You have one group that “found” this country gained power through manipulation (to the point where it is trained in business school nowadays) and gained wealth as the other group had no rights at all

    – You have another group that has always been at a disadvantage… even working as slaves to the people with the “power”

    NOW if 1) the disadvantaged people started an artistic culture based on musical expression (more than once) …. 2) the people in power do it not as well… but gain MORE attention and recognition while 3) the people who are disadvantaged lose appeal and opportunities that could help that gain more power for themselves ….
    Then 4) Why wouldn’t that disadvantaged group wan’t to claim ownership after the this has happened repeatedly?

    This could be said the same about Women or Nations or any time there a any kind of relationship with a power imbalance…. With Hip Hop… In America… it just so happens to be race

  27. RealAngel7

    Some Of You Color Blind and All You See Is Black and White, Take The Head Out Of Your Ass, So Maybe You Can See Clearly, For I Do and Music Is All Colors, No Matter Who Started What, Green, Blue, Black and White.

  28. majesticking

    Music is colorblind in fact I’ve seen music unite all human families all over the planet, that’s not the point, people tend to pay too much attention to how one expresses themselves instead of what their actually expressing, some people come cold some warm stop allowing oneself to get caught up in how one says what their saying and pay attention to whats being said, in a nutshell the hip hop culture was birthed from the urban experiences of youth in the early 70’s in the Bronx which consisted mainly of black and latinos. Kool Herk is credited as being the founder and he’s black yet if the word black offends anyone I’ll say Original. Peace!

  29. brotha_man

    IDGAF i bump evidence, brother ali, yelawolf, mac miller, aesop rock, bk one, dessa, …..as long as u come correct. i support real hip hop no matter the color

      • brotha_man

        lil wyte might the most slept on IMO……MGK stole his style

      • Inmadopicouroz✓QUEENSᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        I met Wyte in about Sept-Oct 2004 a little after “who gives a what where u from” I know it wasn’t his song but that was big at that time. I aint a fan of too many south rappers but he is an under dog.

      • Inmadopicouroz✓QUEENSᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        Yo momma sounds great when she ride it when we fu(kin!!!

      • brotha_man

        u wouldnt know what to do wit pu$$y if it slapped u in the face u bi#ch made junkie.

    • Inmadopicouroz✓QUEENSᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

      ur list is horrible, Never listen to QUEENS niccas, we have too many that you would lose your mind u lame azzz squid!

      • brotha_man

        there u go again puffing that lil bird chest out acting like u a tough guy. u probably work a couple shifts a week a mcd’s ol lame azz living in ur mama basment azz do boi

      • Inmadopicouroz✓QUEENSᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        there u go again! foh! I aint tough, just tougher than you!

      • brotha_man

        i bet u shook in queens, ur ho3 azz prob live in rhode island…stop repping queens fraud

      • Inmadopicouroz✓QUEENSᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

        I’d stomp you out senseless u lame azzz nicca!

      • brotha_man

        ok small town, we get it u think u tuff….u bi#ch made



    • water_ur_seeds

      Thats not true, have you read Malcolm’s autobiography? When he went to Mecca he saw black, white and eastern people etc people of all colours, races and nationalities all worshipping Allah, thats what changed his perception of people, and in away made him start looking at people just as humans and not judging people on the colour of their skin…




      • cromthelaughinggod7

        I always chime in from time to time when things are misplaced. You are speaking crazy. First off no one gives you store. You work for it or get a lone. What are you lazy? Plus it is not a hand out religion. Also if people eat pork then they are not walking the path. You need to worry about your own way of life because Christians go to church on Sunday and kill their wife so lets not play Muslim bashing. If you don’t know about a religion don’t fabricate lies. No one on planet earth is perfect. Also there are “black” Muslims from Sudan, and all over Africa so you don’t know what you are talking about. There is a masjid or mosque right next to me and guess what the iman is black as a matter of fact black American. Go to Philly you will see a lot of that, NYC, DC etc. Brothers go into business with each all the time. I had a brother help me before from Afghanistan so stop stereotyping people. I am black by the way and long time ahh member. You sound like one of those Hebrew Israelite’s that blast everyone and twist scripture to fit their needs. You can’t speak for a nation of people. Unless you can appear at every place on earth to make a accurate judgement on people’s character you sound ignorant.



      • Immortal

        Water both you and Elder have points. Malcolm did see the light when he made the pilgrimage, and realized that Islam was bigger than one race or creed, but at the same time, I’ve seen where Elder is also correct in that some “True” Arab Muslims do not really care for Black or “American” Muslims and consider them as fake. Not going to say all are like this because that would be stupid and categorizing all when it’s just a substantial few. I’ve witnessed this at home, in Europe, and in Afghanistan. And let’s not even get into whether you’re Shia or Sunni, it just gets worse from there.

  31. IL4M


    • Immortal

      Cosign!! If the person can make quality music who really cares? The elements of Hip Hop never mentioned a color or race. More importantly, let’s make rap a wrap and bring back Hip Hop without the mainstream BS that is out today.

    • Elayorx El

      This is all well, and good. But if it cannot be all for one, then it cannot possibly be one for all. It can’t be had both ways, because I am quite sure most of those participants in Hip-Hop’s infancy, had no idea of the monster that was waiting for them, in the form of “real life”, that hopefully did not do most of them in, as I would love to hear from some of them about this. I’m sure a lot of those same folks have switched their views now, as we all are pretty much aware of how hard it is to deal with actual truth.

      • IL4M

        A lil something I found, this is from back in the day too.
        “The coming together of the uptown rap scene with the downtown punks was the beginning of a melding of musical movements that had previously just observed each other from a distance. Uptown and downtown innovators started collaborating in New York and on an international scale. Bands like The Beastie Boys, Gang Of Four, Rip Rig Panic, The Slits, Bush Tetras, Liquid Liquid and PIL fell under the influence of dub, reggae, funk and disco. Even college kids like Talking Heads got into the action. Suddenly The Clash were being played in the discos and white hipsters were dancing to Grandmaster Flash and Afrika Bambaataa at the Mudd Club.”

      • Elayorx El

        Wowww, no doubt. I have always since a likkle yoot been a serious music fan, and I have not seen, much less heard from some of those groups in years.(becoming a young father’ll do that to you) But I feel you, and I would say that period was pre-political, which later on forced the hand of some, to make decisions they normally, probably never would have even considered. Very sad, and a shame, but we do want unity, really, considering nothing but a person’s spirit, heart, and deeds, but this place…this world seems to fight that, with every step, leaving me to agree with Mechelle Ndegeocello when she says how cold, and lonely this world really is. Yet, and still though, I will always have, “This Must Be The Place”, by the Talking Heads, as one of my favorite life theme songs, because deep down I feel most truly know that tunes like that, are what life should really be all about. Thanks for the info fam. One L…

      • IL4M

        For sure fam! very Poetic look at it, I can dig it. We headed in the right direction and one day we shall overcome for real. – 1!!

  32. Eric Collapsar

    It’s kind of clear that a lot of people have never heard Bam speak on the music he played, or the people coming to his parties and other sets that were being thrown.

  33. cricejr

    Its really hard for me to get what Buck is tryin to do. To say something like white people can blame any part of racism on black people makes me think he has a album with macklmore or some shit in the near future.

  34. hoeyuno

    Wild Style and Style Wars both had white boys in in it. The rock steady crew had people’s of all colors spinning on there heads! Graffiti artists Seen, zephyr etc…Hip Hop has no race but rappers use to be about 99% black

  35. BulldogCG

    I wasn’t there when Hip Hop started so I can’t call that. I would tend to believe at the base of the form, there were not white folks present. As it grew, which was quickly, I think it diversified quickly. That being said, I agree with Buckshot’s sentiment. Lord Jamar is a separatist. Calling people “guests” and all that. If a white person called me a “guest” in America, we would have problems. I think Jamar seems like he hate’s white folks. I am about progress, unity, common ground and moving forward personally. Anything separatist, from any color or religion, I aint with myself.

    • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

      Jump into NASCAR and even if you win they will be sure to let you know that you are nothing more than a GUEST in a heartbeat… regardless of how many Daytona 500 races you win.

      • BulldogCG

        Courtesy of Wiki-pedia.

        Ex NBA’er Brad Daugherty hasn’t had any issue. He is a Nascar Owner, How many Black Americans have owned an NFL team? Or more than 10% of an NBA Franchise. This was 97.

        Following his retirement from the NBA, Daugherty co-owned a NASCAR Camping World Truck Series team (Liberty Racing) featuring such drivers as Kenny Irwin Jr. and Kevin Harvick. In 1997 Irwin won two Craftsman Truck Series races driving for Daugherty (Homestead-Miami Speedway in March and Texas Motor Speedway in June). Daugherty joined ESPN’s return to NASCAR racing telecasts in 2007.[5] He is currently an analyst on the weekly topical show Inside NASCAR on Showtime, and on NASCAR Now, a nightly newscast on the sport. He is also part owner of JTG Daugherty Racing, which owns the #47Bush’s Baked Beans Toyota Camry driven by Bobby Labonte and A.J. Allmendinger.[6]

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        You are focused on making an excuse and I am focused on your flawed logic. I give you Basketball and Football which are mainly made up of black players yet the coaching, front office and Owners all show another picture. The facts are the facts, there’s no need to make excuses, just do the research. You can get holy and preach all you want but your words don’t match reality. Give me five other black dudes doing it big in THE HISTORY OF NASCAR? Oh that’s right, you can’t. I wonder why? Must be all of those blacks who would love to get into NASCAR simply being lazy lol! Or maybe, they just don’t want to knock Daugherty hustle and don’t want to still his shine lol! Come on man, what is the percentage of blacks in NASCAR? I know you want to give a rhetorical you can do all things if you put your mind to it preach, which just proves that you are clueless.

      • BulldogCG

        I have no idea, lol. It aint the point, your the one that gave flawed logic and I offered you a reality check, take it or don’t. We see things differently. My point is, I am not with separatist verbiage or ideas, period, you taking it somewhere else. Everyone knows white men run the country, that aint the point, and that is why I said “transcend.” Of course there is racism and of course there are problems, but that aint gotta stop you. I don’t really know what you trying to say, if you want to say something, say it. lol.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        “stop looking at others, and you can transcend anything,” <—- So you have no knowledge beyond the biracial brother that they hand picked to be apart of their situation to brag on? Like the homie said above, give me 3 more since you want to talk equality and excuses.

        "My point is, I am not with separatist verbiage or ideas, period, you taking it somewhere else." <— You have no point, the facts are what they are regardless of the dream world that you decide to live within. Oh wait, I get it, you let off that first round on Daugherty now you are out of ammunition lol!

        "Everyone knows white men run the country, that aint the point, and that is why I said "transcend." <—- Ight, cool, so please show me exactly where this has happened before in NASCAR. FYI, anytime you can only name one, you are naming a token.

        "but that aint gotta stop you." <— No one has even eluded to being stopped by anything. No one is falling for that BS, it's clear that you don't know what you are talking about lol!

      • BulldogCG

        all you can talk about is NASCAR and Daugherty? And I don’t know anything? lol

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        You came out with the name and ran out of details right after. Only fools speak on topics they know nothing about beyond a cosmetic level.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        Anyone can name ONE or even a few! One black move into a neighborhood on the “other” side of town and they just might not face any issues. Now when you look up and see say… 10 move into the NASCAR and let me see you post the outcome on that. Matter of fact, can you please give me the how many Blacks are in NASCAR percentage wise…. I’ll wait.

      • BulldogCG

        We don’t really ski, or swim, or play soccer, what that mean??? Point is he eating and eating good, if he thought like you, he would be limited, that is mental poison, can’t be blaming other men gotta go out and get it, like he couldn’t have followed the stereotype and just stayed an NBA announcer?nah he stayed true to himself and made a lane. TRUTH homey: Do you, stop looking at others, and you can transcend anything, especially today.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        “We don’t really ski, or swim, or play soccer, what that mean???” <— Who are we? We are not the same and I bet we don't come from the same place so you lost me with the French talk and all. I don't look to blame anyone for anything but I also don't get caught up in that "We are all on the same level" BS either. We were just reminded of that with what happened to Hip Hop at the Grammy's but hey hey hey "stop looking at others, and you can transcend anything." LOL!

      • BulldogCG

        we, black americans, which i am, who I thought we were talking about. Who were you referring to? Where you thinking we were having a global conversation?

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        The topic is actually about equality. Read a little.

      • BulldogCG

        actually my thread was about separatism being bad, so go back and re check. lol.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        Which has nothing to do with nothing. Besides, separatism means the advocacy or practice of separation of a certain group of people from a larger body on the basis of ethnicity, religion, or gender. I didn’t see that anywhere on here. But then again, I’m sure that degree may not cover that.

      • BulldogCG

        its all about usage homey, want a lesson? There are about a million definitions of every word, lol.

      • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

        Usage? It’s actually all about proper context homie… get it right.

      • BulldogCG

        Usage, takes into account context and many other factors. lol

      • Hugh Johnson

        truth is, we take over everything we do. that’s why “they” spend so much time trying to hold us back. they even banned the damn rick ross video hold me back lol. youtube search surya bonaly . she did a backfli[p on skates in the 98 Olympics and they hated on her for it!!!!!!!!!! they’re scared as hell when they see us so they have to try to take credit for everything so we don’t know ourselves. I used to listen to brand Nubian, but I was a BCC FAN. I still am, but Buck, you reachin with this one, son!

      • Papi Peligro

        Man you got mental chain bra. You can’t tell our children to only color with certain crayons out the box. White people don’t have those restrictions. We need to be able to create and be supported for our achievements. You segregating yourself.

      • BulldogCG

        I am not sure that is the conversation we were having. The point is we can come together or hate one another, I prefer the former. I aint got time to be hating folks, if they aint keeping me from eating.

  36. Southcidal

    Buckshot trying get them white sales and white dollars huh. LMAO. We are the victims of “Stand Your Ground” but we still find it necessary to defend white people. I guess crackers started jazz too huh?

  37. Elayorx El

    …..and herein lies the problem, where you have some who want to actually deal with the issues that are apparent, and those who choose to dismiss things, no matter the gravity, usually due to motives unmentioned. I’m a little surprised at Buck, but with the advantage of hindsight, I really can’t recall when he ever made mention in his rhymes of certain problems that could have used his voice. However, certain things are not for everybody, and BCC as a whole did cover a lot of ground, but since he has chosen to publicly disagree with Lord J, the next natural step would have to be some sort of discourse between the two. Hopefully this can manifest itself soon, and be done with tact, and respect, in the name of Hip-Hop culture, truly. We give thanks, both to Brand Nubian, and BCC. One L….

  38. Isaac Hayes

    Respect Buckshot but couldn’t disagree more Hip Hop is a Black Art Form I know the rest of BCC have there own opinion. Damn Buckshot you sound like some of the hippies that be here on AHH comments section(you know who you are) Man you can miss me with that we are all human beings b*ll$hit!. I live in Amerikkka my skin is my sin. I’m about to send Drop Squad to your door step

      • Kweli

        Don’t assume I haven’t just because it doesn’t fit your perception.

      • Elayorx El

        Nah, I feel you, but even a “Rhodes Scholar”, can benefit from, “further research”.

    • Isaac Hayes

      Foreign to Black Americans true but most Arabs in Africa are Nubian aka Black so I will give you the benefit of the doubt if you are trying to make a point.

      • Kweli

        Of course most (or many) Arabs in Africa are Black. Hell, most Christians in Africa are also Black. Doesn’t mean these are African indigenous religions. My point is that bros (mostly in NY) sometimes act like Arabic and Islam are Black/African creations, they think they deserve praise or a cookie for simply being Muslim, when it ain’t that different than Christianity. Both of these religions have a history of being anti-African (Black), including slavery.

      • Papi Peligro

        Islam is not a Africa religion. Its why Suleiman got his slaves from Eastern Africa and Europe because it was illegal for a muslim to own another muslim as a slave. They lost though. They want so bad to prove superiority.

      • Kweli

        Of course Islam is not an African religion. That was one of my original points.

  39. jball8

    Real talk. Hip hop is everywhere at this point in time. I don’t judge rappers based on anything except ability, same with people. All the race stuff and the who influence who stuff is played out to me. We all influence each other. Listen to what you like. I don’t listen to the radio; I just check for what I like. For white rappers I like Evidence, Action Bronson, Alchemist, 7L & Esoteric and Slaine to name a few.

    • Pirate7X

      Evidence is biracial, African-American/white Italian.

      Must be nice to just say “race stuff is played out to me…” I mean that seriously. I’d love to simply enjoy music, film, news, internet, etc. and not worry about how race comes into play with each perception and image. Unfortunately it’s not like that for myself or most folks of color.

  40. cza jones

    A white man invented baksetball , a canadian one. are all black people today guests in a white mans game? No . let go of the boundaries that were once set and defined and just let hip hop be hip hop. its not what it was 20 years ago. A black man in USA was a slave and now is president. I agree 100% with buckshot. were supposed to be so far past this, and thats why topics like this still exist, because were not. theres still too much hatred, too much anger about our past that we can’t move forward until we rid of this nonsense. Lord jamar is not in a state of forgiveness or absolute peace or content and until he is , statements like this will hold true to people like him and to people who share his feelings.

    • Montezuma1

      If a white man invented basketball then there’s no offense in stating that. White men still control basketball by the way so no one has to tell blacks we’re visitors the situation speaks for itself. That’s the difference between blacks and whites. Whites rarely have to claim anything because they control most things and their power is understood without being spoken. There’s nothing wrong with Jamar speaking facts. Blacks created rap and pointing it out is not meant to attack anyone but to underline how we have become so irrelevant in a genre we created. This is not by chance. It is surely by design. Our irrelevance was facilitated by commercialization and the compromise of our originality which made us relevant in the first place. Now we have blacks pandering for a check like Buckshot instead of being creative and staying ahead of the curve. I support Jamar. I don’t think he’s racist nor a homophobe. He’s a proud black man and as a black man myself I concur with the onslaught on ALL fronts we contend with. Simply because our antagonists prey upon us discreetly and covertly doesn’t mean we have to retaliate in silence.

      • @Real_SirJamie

        I’m not claiming to have all the answers but I think at least a couple of my people’s problems lie within pride in the wrong things, and for some reason we can not stick together. We HAVE the control TOGETHER but the things I stated before keep us blinded. Basketball (or the most popular sports for that matter that and football) don’t work if we strike. But we care more about the money. And the labels wouldn’t be able to jerk us and dictate the music format if we all went independent.

    • Huey Mansa Musa Abeyi

      How many BLACK owners, GMs and Team Presidents do you see in this white man’s sport? Exactly! Interchange players with guest and it is the same thing with your fake smart, real stupid ass.

  41. Montezuma1

    Buckshot is selling out right here. He’s been in LA with the weirdos too long so now he has to speak for his benefactors. White trust fund babies enamored with hip hop who pay his bills. So what he speaks Arabic. Is he Arab? No. He’s just confused. He doesn’t know who he is or what he is. Just go hang out with Marlon Wayons and Omar Epps Buckshot or is it Backshot these days?

  42. Charter

    Buckshot doesn’t seem to realize “skin” is an organ… in fact the largest organ of the human body. So based on his argument, his point is moot, in fact he scored points on his own hoop for Jamar.

    The largest, most exposed organ is dramatically different from one group to the next.

    • james

      Actually the differences are the amount of melanin that are produced in the skin, a few extra layers on the stratum corneum, and a higher lipid content. Granted, while these attributes provide greater resistance to Sun damage and are less prone to developing wrinkles (which are positive and desirable attributes), there aren’t many blatant differences.

  43. Pirate7X

    “To all my Godz who know who’s the ‘colored’ man
    The ‘colored’ man is the obvious you understand?

    I kill him, and drill him in my Boot Camp,
    Who can’t, survive in the creek you cant…”

    === MURDER MC’S 1994 – Black Moon (written by Buckshot ‘the B.D. Eye’) ===

      • Pirate7X

        ’nuff respect Elayorx El.
        That’s that realness for the heads who ain’t ready. Buck had words for the colored (white/caucasian) man though much has changed over the past 2 decades…

      • Elayorx El

        Bless up, and nuff respect the same, Pirate7X! Absolutely agree!

  44. king

    Hip hop is a black art form like golf is a white art form doesn’t mean another race can’t succeed in anyone they choose try.

  45. pauleyPee

    I mean, hip-hop started with Herc’s parties in the Bronx or with the Zulu Nation, depending on who you talk to…So, of course it’s a black urban art form spawned out of the craving and alienated streets of 1970’s urban New York. That’s not even a debate. But, is there room for artists of other ethnicities? Yes, even though some just don’t possess an authentic vibe.

    In regards to Macklemore, a few things… The latest album sounds absolutely tremendous. It was recorded and mixed impeccably. Lyrically, his style is technically nice and unique. But overall, it just lacks a certain quality that is inherent and cohesive across the spectrum in rap. And the main reason that the aforementioned elements are missing in his music is because he and Ryan Lewis are total outsiders to the culture (culture being the greater urban and/or black cultures). So again, any ethnicity can make any form of music. But when you’re not of the originating culture, there is no masking that…………………………….

    But white people in hip-hop have nothing on white people growing dreads, donning phony jamaican grammar, and calling themselves a reggae band. Can you imagine Punjabi Merengue?

    • Pirate7X

      Excellent points Jordan Pauley. My thought especially relating to your statements dealing with Herc & Universal Zulu Nation:

      I give thanks to AFRIKA BAMBATAA and the UNIVERSAL ZULU NATION for establishing the organization of this Hip Hop Kulture and all it’s elements.

      I sense Bam titled this culture ZULU for 3 reasons: 1) after visiting South Afrika as a youth and seeing the film Zulu Dawn (stated often by Bam himself) , he wanted to name this culture after on of the strongest Afrikan nations who fought European colonization. 2) Bam knew that if he and we don’t claim this culture as AFRIKAN first and foremost, it could be exploited as other movements like Rock n Roll and Jazz were co-opted and diluted. 3) The culture is ‘Universal’ and ‘Zulu’ (the heavens); it’s for all people but
      never forget it’s AFRIKAN, Black culture. Especially set off by Caribbean people from Jamaica, Puerto Rico and the various islands. The icon for Universal Zulu Nation is the map of continental Afrika with the fist centered. ALL members from Russia to Japan to Sudan are Zulus regardless of nationality or ethnicity. Though we are all AFRIKAN where humanity was born.

      Afrika Bambataa was and is claiming this culture Hip Hop as OURS. It is truly Universal Zulu Nation, for the entire universe. But it originated from the original man from Afrika. All humans are family born of Mother Afrika, respect that same as Hip Hop.

  46. Hugh Johnson

    truth is, we take over everything we do. that’s why “they” spend so much time trying to hold us back. they even banned the damn rick ross video hold me back lol. but for real youtube search surya bonaly . she did a backfli[p on skates in the 98 Olympics and they hated on her for it!!!!!!!!!! they’re scared as hell when they see us so they have to try to take credit for everything so we don’t know ourselves. I used to listen to brand Nubian, but I was a BCC FAN. I still am, but Buck, you reachin with this one, son!

  47. King Kredible

    Buck is right and all you clowns got it twisted. 5%, 10%, 85% has NOTHING to do with race. If you think it does, then you don’t know 120. My lessons say the 5% are poor righteous teachers, not black poor righteous teachers. I don’t know what yours say. Guess what else, 35-50 years is not that long. Most of you all are racist and on some black shit. Godbody isn’t.

    • Pirate7X

      Again trickster:

      “To all my Godz who know who’s the ‘colored’ man
      The ‘colored’ man is the obvious you understand?

      I kill him, and drill him in my Boot Camp,
      Who can’t, survive in the creek you cant…”

      === MURDER MC’S 1994 – Black Moon (written by Buckshot ‘the B.D. Eye’) ===

  48. richard_b_hard

    Buckshot……..this nigga……he had a jew (dru ha) “Dru ha gets the paper blackmoon still gets the props” running duck down so of course he will not realize what he is really saying.
    Everything black people CREATE others find ways to market and exploit and all black people ever get is partial credit,If niggas didn’t start hip hop and rap music would be limited to country,rock and classical.

  49. La'shaun Saint Claire

    well, here’s this shit again, and islam isn’t the black man religion, are you going to debate over that buck? Please who cares, the art is damage and most of the lyrics are garbage now, so you want to argue with a former alumni over who started this bull s hit. Please, focus on something better than the petty.


      Who was the first to worship Islam??? The black man was worshiping Islam and Christianity long before any others!!! Do some research on it. But you are right about the art being damaged. And I think it might be beyond repair!!!

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        being the first to practice Bronze Age mumbo Jumbo is hardly an achievement worth regaling brother.

      • Robert Neems

        here goes this bigot again. leave your comments to yourself.

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        If i’m a bigot for criticising religion then so be it.

        upon reflection the difference between us appears to be that you believe the historical accounts that you like the sound of; whereas I basically don’t trust any of them that are over around a thousand years old. How does that make me a bigot? Let’s see, well i’ll tell you one way that you’re right; one of the definitions of bigotry is “one who distrusts” and in that sense I certainly am a bigot. But that hardly seems a bad characteristic… however, it also states that a bigot is “someone who views others with contempt because of their beliefs”; well that seems to fit your with your behaviour towards me… so it seems we may both be guilty.

        tell me then, why do you trust the historical accounts of bronze age mammals (and even those from before) ? I mean are these accounts not from the same time when people believed that if you were having an epileptic fit, you had in the devil in you? The same people who believed that if you heard voices in your head you were a prophet? And the same people who believed that lightning was gods anger?

        Why would you trust historical documents from when humans were in their infancy (as a species)?

        I don’t just believe for the sake of believing. If there wasn’t physical evidence of the transatlantic slave trade and it was just something that was written in a book with no other evidence I probably wouldn’t trust that either – that is just the nature of scientific enquiry; the need for something more than secondary evidence.

        So unless you can show some scientific evidence/proof that ‘when black people ruled the world everything was gravy, no slavery existed and everyone treated each other with respect’; there’s no reason to believe it; the onus is on the claimer to prove their claims.. If i said the universe was created by a flying spaghetti monster, it would be up to me to prove it, not you to disprove it.

        And please don’t point me towards the writings of a mammal either.

        *micheal corleone voice* “just when i thought i was out…”

      • Robert Neems

        Yes bigot, your lack of trust in historical accounts, documentation, and record proving Africa’s reign prior to European’s brutal dominance stems from your White Supremacist’s ideology. You choose not believe it. You see thats the difference between Eurocentricity and Afrocentricity. Or European culture and African culture. African’s take oral history, written documentation very seriously since the inception of our people. You say this people were primitive in thought when they were far more advanced than you’ve been taught. You’ve been brainwashed to see ancient man as “mammals” and such, when thats the racist teachings of white men perpetuating these lies in institutionalized education.

        “I mean are these accounts not from the same time when people believed that if you were having an epileptic fit, you had in the devil in you? The same people who believed that if you heard voices in your head you were a prophet? And the same people who believed that lightning was gods anger?”

        These accounts and explanations were your people who thought like that, not Africans who were far more advanced in the sciences, mathematics, philosophy, etc. Your were inferior in that regard. The Dogon people for thousand’s of years knew about the Sirius Star system, and the 3rd unseen star, before the west discovered this “mystery” in the 19th century. So stop it with that BULLSHIT. We were far more advanced than you’ve illustrated here.
        Just when I thought you were out!!! Go home bigot!

      • Opposite Of Everyone

        I see all humans as mammals as thats what they are (biologically); and why do you think I’m white? Have all black people you’ve met read the same books or something?

        i am not rubbishing ancient african history anymore than i am saying the same for the history of any other culture; I’m saying all human history (especially that beyond the point of there being any available primary evidence) is unreliable and by definition biased. I’m saying all history is biased, culturally, by the interests of those writing or recording it, by the limitations of their knowledge of other cultures and also by the limitations of human ego.

        The day to day social mechanics of African civilisation thousands of years cannot be proven other than by unreliable evidence. That’s not to say historical sources are all wrong it’s just that they can’t be proven as scientific fact and are therefore by default unreliable.

        CIting African knowledge of solar systems does not provide evidence of their being no slavery or everyone treating everyone with respect, thats just conjecture !

        You don’t know who my people were but the fact you’re so ready to assume these things simply compounds your lack of requirement for any concrete evidence of anything; you’re just dealing with gut instinct and not even interested if it’s accurate or not !


    Her it is in a “nut shell”!!! Earlier “Hip Hop” was a form of playing the “DOZENS”, which comes from the African American culture, and through the years we put music to it from different genres!!! We spoke about what was going on in our communities, so with that being said, “BUCK SHOT” is wrong!!! This is our schitt, and always will be, even though “Hip Hop” is suffering, and lacking in creativity!!! We all should have known that as soon as it left the “HOOD”, and corporate American put its hands on it, and suburbanites took notice the games was going to change and for the worse!!!

  51. HalfPast7

    When you go back in time and look at the Bronx in the 1970s, you didn’t see any young white people in the hood like that. It wasn’t poor white people who started this shit, they saw and chose to emulate yes but it wasn’t their idea. Back then all you saw was Black and Spanish people in the hood, therefore, their creativity spilled onto the streets. This Buckshot nigga jus tryna expand the gay/white/feminine takeover that’s already happenin in the hip hop culture. It happened to rock, jazz, blues, etc. Most white people don’t kno shit about rap or hip hop but yet they the ones that voted for Mackelmore, that ain’t no coincidence that’s just the beginning, 30 years from now I wouldn’t be surprised if it was nothing but white rappers everywhere.

  52. Deserteagle911

    what he smokin? if Hip Hop was white it would have been all over the radio and in movies and packing stadiums and artists would have been getting million dollar endorsements and sponsorships and lucrative record label deals from the get-go back in the 70’s. that fact alone crushes his bullshit. it would have been all over MTV the moment it went on air in the 80’s and that shit would be in all the elevators and there would only be like 5 black rappers LOL! GTFOH.

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