Twelve years ago, you’d never catch Nas in the streets without a ton of reefer. Today, the King Poetic has turned over a new leaf, and no longer splits the leaves of his cigars. Perhaps it’s a new frame of mind for a 33-year-old rapper who went from snubbing Jesus to being the same age as the Christian messiah at his death. Perhaps this maturity has created a new perspective for the Queensbridge icon. With the forthcoming Hip-Hop is Dead Nas is candid about his mature views on the music that so many critics say he advanced a decade ago. But the question remains, if Hip-Hop is dead, can Nasir Jones – or anybody else for that matter, revive it? Just before the last rites, Nas arrives with one mic.

AllHipHop.com: If Hip-Hop is dead, who killed it?

Nas: Corporate America and DJs, radio programmers, video/TV programming, the rappers, us. We all just had a whole bunch of fun. We had too much fun. Because you got to live your life, know what I mean. And it’s a business. And business, it kills it, you know what I mean, business then kills it and s**t. AllHipHop.com: Well you maybe out and Hip-Hop is dead, so you referring to a specific chapter or just a general, conclusive data? Nas: I mean, it just came to me from people. I just heard people talking and I was just in the streets. So I would say the streets named the album. AllHipHop.com: So you’re just saying the street does it, that doesn’t mean that you necessarily agree? Nas: I totally agree. Yeah it’s just dead man. I’m free now. AllHipHop.com: So you’re not making Hip-Hop anymore. What are you making if Hip-Hop — Nas: I don’t know what it is – some s**t right. Crack music, whatever. It’s f**ked up. AllHipHop.com: Well, I mean the reason you give, then you mentioned working with a different caliber of producers for this next album. Give us a little insight as to who we can expect to hear from the album… Nas: Well, some people I’ve been working with, you know Salaam Remi, L.E.S., you know Dr. Dre, not as much but Dre. Premier, you know — AllHipHop.com: What happened to the Premier/ Nas album? Nas: Yeah, well that’s some s**t we want to do, you know. I think we really got to set aside some time to do it. You know, ‘cause when I’m ready to do it, I’m ready to do it at a certain kind of way and Premier got his way of doing it. We just got to really settle down because I want it to be an idea thing, like a concept from beginning to end, the theme you know. AllHipHop.com: Okay, I see you. So I also heard that you have Will.I.Am… Nas: Oh yeah Will.I.Am. I’ll definitely have. AllHipHop.com: So you know that throws a lot of people left because there’s a lot of people in Hip-Hop and your fans kind of regard you as above ground, with underground sound, know what I mean? Nas: Yeah, yeah. AllHipHop.com: Do you even give a damn what people think? Nas: Um –Yeah, well Will.I.Am is the truth. He’s the truth, man. That dude is… he’s advanced. He loves Hip-Hop so much, he could out break-dance anybody. He’s all the way involved. Don’t be surprised you catch him doing graffiti on subway somewhere. You know we don’t get a chance to see that because his group [Black Eyed Peas] is so large, you know. We don’t get to see who he really is.

AllHipHop.com: So what do you say to your fans who feel like you basically like sold yourself out in signing with Jay?

Nas: I signed with Def Jam. I didn’t sign with Jay. You know what I’m saying? Like, I’m not signing with Roc-A-Fella. I’m signing to myself, joint venture situation with Jones Experience [Nas’ new label]. And I’m actually still in with Sony. This album is a collective thing with some [people], but it was my idea to, or it was my thing to, you know help make the situation [work]. I had to go in there as a royalty act on Sony and deal with people knowing that [Sony] was a sinking ship for me, and it was my time to leave.

So you know there’s… you respect the Clive Davis’ and a lot of other Lyor Cohen’s, but who else will respect a movement of two Black men resolving something that started, this whole battle, situation for the last four-and-a-half years, where eHip-Hop’s gone crazy and it’ll probably kill New York rap, just from “Ether” and “Takeover.” Who else will respect us? They don’t care if the music and the culture suffers. So if we don’t stand up and come together in positions of power… this is God’s plan. This is not, there’s no disrespect, but other than a non-Black executive that would honor the situation. This is not a sellout. This is everything that was intended for the truth to be expressed this time. AllHipHop.com: Well where would you place yourself in the top MCs if you had to? Where do you think is your position in rap history when it’s all said and done? Nas: When it’s all said and done they all come after me, every last one of ‘em, White or Black. AllHipHop.com: Who’s that — Nas: Rappers. They all come from me, you know what I’m saying? At some point in time, whether it’s the shock value in these guys’ verses from when I first started, and you heard them start regurgitated and different artists talk about doing things and Jesus is now he’s dead, the shock value sound [referring to lyrics like, “I went to hell for snuffin’ Jesus,” lyrics or the lyrical pattern, or it’s the consciousness upbringing. It’s the balance upbringing. This all belongs to me. And that’s a lot, a lot of times I see what’s happening with New York rappers, they don’t have enough style in their personality, in what they talk about off the records, when they not rapping. When they not rapping, they like back in the days I couldn’t get on say, like [disrespecting] Rakim’s wife or Big Daddy Kane’s son, and I’m gonna diss him in a record. That was blasphemy. You never did a record that, now it’s so messed up and New York is the kings of savvy and style. But we up here, lost and confused, disrespecting each other, that’s not how it’s done. Old school, some of that old school used to hate on us. My place now is to say y’all all my kids. But Ice Cube can really say it. KRS can really say it, but I’m having fun saying it too. AllHipHop.com: But I mean here in New York you know, this whole New York, bring back to New York, what is that about? Do you co-sign that?

Nas: Yeah, but I mean New York is New York. It ain’t going nowhere. Yeah, I mean the thing is you know everybody else is having fun while everybody else is doing what they do. Up here, you know, everybody is confused; they [are] lost. You know [in the] ‘80s, we used to look up to you know a lot of different people from different walks of life. And you know everybody…I wear white t-shirts everyday too, but that’s an L.A. thing. You know what I’m saying. It’s more melting pot and that’s good because we all connecting with each others’ style and everything but then New York, I remember you know what we do. AllHipHop.com: So in your opinion, to bring New York back we need to get that swagger back, basically? Nas: To bring New York back we got to take it seriously, you know what I’m saying? They gotta take they selves seriously. Everybody’s like microwave music now, know what I mean, ‘cause it’s the way to eat. When I was doing this early on, [I did Hip-Hop] because I loved it. Now, they not artists, they opportunists. So it’s just a way to eat now. And that’s cool. But then of course, the music is gonna suffer.

AllHipHop.com: You mentioned The Jones Experience. So you have two label brands, along with Ill Will?

Nas: I have Ill Will for my release records, not over here in Def Jam. This Def Jam is Jones experience. AllHipHop.com: Okay. And what about Ill Will because I know you had big plans for the label but never really — Nas: It never came to fruition and I kind of wanted to put it to rest; it’s like, because it didn’t come to fruition, my dude was just part of the shine over me, getting me to do the slave s**t, know what I’m saying?

AllHipHop.com: And whatever happened to Quan? Nas: I don’t know. AllHipHop.com: You have no idea? Nas: No. AllHipHop.com: So what’s this treadmill? I feel that you get linked with cats and you’re supportive of them and they just kind of like — Nas: It’s a hard place. It’s a hard road to travel. You know it’s not easy to move. You got to be like, a lot of people think they gonna get…it’s real. You can’t get in this and expect you gonna be Michael Jackson tomorrow. You got to put it down. You gonna have to take some, you gonna have to put your, you know, get in shape man, and let’s go at it. ‘Cause you know I’m not in this for faking. You know what I’m saying. And a lot of people think like you know why didn’t you sign me or why didn’t you sign me? It’s like I don’t think you’re the next Snoop Dogg. Do you think they’re the next Snoop? I got it, like asking these artists, do you really think you can pack [Madison Square Garden] one day in five years, ten years. How? What are you talking about? I’m looking for someone who can grow. They don’t have to do it overnight, but I’m looking for someone who really loves what they do. They take it down and you know it really come from the heart. They’re ready to go in and go hard. AllHipHop.com: So, you’ve been at this a long time, what would you say the biggest difference with the game now than when you got in? Nas: It wasn’t as much paper. Paper changed a lot. It wasn’t as easy to get in. You know dudes got it made today. AllHipHop.com: Well you just said it was easier for you to get in back then ‘cause it — Nas: For me, yeah. But it wasn’t a bunch of [imitations] out there. You had this guy, we had, we had everybody get airtime. Everybody got whatever happening label. Everybody’s doing it. You know you can’t walk down the street without some n***a without a record label and rap.

AllHipHop.com: Is this a good thing or a bad thing?

Nas: I think it’s great that we all love the rap game and that we all into it. I think it’s not good with the misunderstanding of what comes along being in it. You know they say like that less than 1% of n***as out here is gonna make it to where they see they selves supposed to be, and that’s kinda harsh reality.

AllHipHop.com: Word has it you have stopped smoking?

Nas: I smoke cigars. I’ve always smoked cigars. That’s you can mature with it man, so you can’t smoke a hundred blunts in one day. You know, you got to party, but every day? For what? AllHipHop.com: A blunt for breakfast. Nas: A blunt for breakfast… AllHipHop.com: What’s the favorite album you got?

Nas: I don’t have one. AllHipHop.com: Come on now, you have to have one. Nas: Definitely don’t have one. AllHipHop.com: Why wouldn’t you have one? Nas: I don’t know what’s on each album. AllHipHop.com: Really?

Nas: Nah, I get confused sometimes [with] what songs are on what album. AllHipHop.com: What would you say is the biggest misconception about you? Nas: That I’m not in total control, of every step of the way. AllHipHop.com: Elaborate on that. Nas: A lot of the weed smoking was the stage that set me free. And I never messed with any of these industry cats because there’s too many, I knew how easy it was for you to be behind a jail cell over one of these flunkies, you know. One of the kookie n***as that have you all tripped up. That ain’t no man s**t. That ain’t even gangsta s**t [to] get tripped up off one of these goofball n***as. So the thing about it, I stayed in my haze. [My] state of mind was perking all day long because I didn’t pay attention to none of that stuff. AllHipHop.com: So how does Nas the rapper different from Mr. Nasir Jones? Nas: I love being on stage. It’s everything to me, but sometimes people don’t know when to turn it off and the way they treat you is like it’s on every day. It’s all about rap, rap every day. They don’t know about life and stuff like that. You know, you gotta have a quality of life. So that’s real important to me. You see dudes frowning up all the time, paranoid and they’re [acting] 16, dude. They’re a grown man with kids, man.

AllHipHop.com: You smile. Nas: Yeah. I smile all the time. AllHipHop.com: What is your idea to stay connected with the youth?

Nas: It is what it is. Youth don’t want you to dumb down, ‘cause they not dumb. So you can’t, you got to do youth. You know they can understand that. [The] same way I understood the dudes that were over me when I was 12, 13 there wasn’t no 12, 13 year olds rapping. They were at least four years older than me if I bought their records. It was always like that.

Sadat X is the definition of what it means to be about your business and on your grind. The one-time teacher, basketball coach, would-be firefighter and rapper is the everyman’s man. Not comfortable with just relying on one gig, the Bronx-bred MC isn’t afraid to take a regular job and hustle like the rest of the blue-collars.

And just like regular folks get caught up in unfortunate situations, the same holds true here. Not too long after the release of the well-received Experience & Education last year, Sadat caught a gun possession charge and will be heading to city jail late October. But not one to let a setback slow him down, he just released another solo, the aptly-titled and very candid Black October.

The Wild Cowboy spoke with AllHipHop.com about his multiple careers, importantly, why you should not send him any ghetto books while he’s in jail.

AllHipHop.com: How long had you been teaching?

Sadat X: For about six years.

AllHipHop.com: Back in the day, was your main gig teaching and then you decided you wanted to get into rapping?

Sadat X: I was a teacher’s assistant … working in the New Rochelle school system. But I was still able to balance that back and forth with the rap, but these last two years since I made the albums [Experience & Education, Black October] during the year, I haven’t been able to teach. A lot of travel for them was being done during the school year and I couldn’t get the time off like that.

AllHipHop.com: What grade?

Sadat X: All grades. I worked from high school to elementary, wherever they sent me.

AllHipHop.com: Did the kids know who you were?

Sadat X: Well some of them did, but these are young kids; I know most of their parents.

AllHipHop.com: Being a Five Percenter, did you find it hard teaching some subjects like Social Studies or History?

Sadat X: Well, I would just break it down into what’s fact and what’s fiction. A lot of the stuff, being that I was a teacher’s assistant, I couldn’t really get into it like how I wanted to—as opposed to me taking full command of the class and teaching what I wanted to teach. A lot of times you have to go along with what the curricula is calling for. But you could still, within the curricula, break down little fallacies. And also, I was working with a lot of kids with behavioral problems, so a lot of that stuff [history lessons] wasn’t even approached. A lot of stuff we were doing was just getting them to be able to behave in the classroom.

AllHipHop.com: What made you go into teaching?

Sadat X: I just like working with kids, that’s all.

AllHipHop.com: Is your teaching license going to be affected by your situation?

Sadat X: I don’t know yet. I haven’t applied back again, so I won’t know until I apply again. Until I go get another job and it pops up on my record …

AllHipHop.com: I’m thinking about the irony that the last album was titled Experience & Education and then this happens … that’s like an experience and education in itself. What do you think about that?

Sadat X: It is. I mean, s**t happens. Got into a situation, s**t jumped off like how it jumped off … do the crime, you gotta do the time. I’m not afraid or anything like that—not by any means. I’m afraid of the boredom of jail, but it’s only for six or seven months. It’ll be all right.

AllHipHop.com: On the song “Black October”, you pretty much said that you had no fear in anything, it was just boredom. You also said, “Don’t send me no ghetto books.” What do you mean by that?

Sadat X: It ain’t nothing wrong with them books like …

AllHipHop.com: A Hustler’s Wife or something like that?

Sadat X: Yeah. But once you read one or two of them books, you basically read them all. I read those stories before and I mean, when I’m in there [jail], I’m already in there with vice and crooks, so I need something a little more challenging.

AllHipHop.com: I was looking at the inside art of Experience & Education and the book that you were reading on the cover. I looked real close at the book cover and it said, Willing Yourself to Live. What’s that all about?

Sadat X: Well, actually, that’s crazy, because that book just happened to be on the table when I took the picture. A lot of people ask me about that and I’m like damn, I’m gonna have to really go back and read that. It must be something behind that.

AllHipHop.com: Back to “Black October.” You said, “I might’ve caught the case ‘cause of the way I reacted.”

Sadat X: Well, I could have reacted better. I could have let the situation be handled another way. My peoples told me they was gonna handle it, and understand, my people are grown men. They not like little boys in the streets; my dudes is grown men. They care about me—they don’t care nothin’ about rap. I knew them before there was rap. That’s why a lot of times when I tell these dudes, when they be saying these lyrics about hustlin’ and doing this, and doing that—I came up in the grown man’s era. I was with the original crew with the backpacks on the Amtrak going to D.C., Virginia, North Carolina and places like that. So a lot of dudes be playing with this, my dudes is serious. So, the situation jumped off and I should have let them handle it, but I chose to handle it.

AllHipHop.com: Can you get into what happened?

Sadat X: It was a beef over — I didn’t like the way that some guys had treated a friend of mine who I came up with, and I took exception to that fact. They had beat my man out of a lot of money, and I took exception to that, being that they live around here and I see this dudes everyday.

AllHipHop.com: So the cops were just there or something?

Sadat X: They called the cops. I didn’t have the gun out. It was two days before Christmas; it’s in the middle of the daytime, Christmas season … I live on Broadway, 157th, 158th, which is probably the biggest drug trade area in the East Coast. There’s a million police over there all the time and so many detectives. If I’d have been in the middle of the street with a gun — in the daytime — I’d have probably been killed. They say it happened in front of McDonald’s — how come nobody from McDonald’s came downstairs and said I was waving a gun? And my charge is not for that. My charge is for possession of a gun, that’s why I only got a year. If it had been anything more than that, I’d be gone for a lot longer. I just got the minimum time.

AllHipHop.com: On “Untraceable,” you said you had to cop a plea because there were no grounds for a trial.

Sadat X: Yeah, I had to cop a plea. I was caught with the gun, so there was no defense in that. I had to take that time. Being that I had a previous gun charge, I took the year as opposed to going to trial and then they bringing that into question. And then if blew the trial, I was looking at three to five. Usually when they make you an offer, they got something behind you.

AllHipHop.com: Even though on one of the songs you said it’s not a farewell, I kind of got the feeling that it was. I got a sense that, if I didn’t know any better, I would think you’d be going away for a real long time.

Sadat X: Nah, I’ll be back in like six or seven months — that’s light. I know dudes that say, “Yo, give me six or seven months.” They would take that like a Christmas present. And I ‘m in the city. I’m not even going up north. I’m in a city jail; I didn’t have to go upstate. That’s when you go to jail.

AllHipHop.com: Yeah, that’s prison, not even jail.

Sadat X: Exactly. That’s prison — I got city time. There are a million Gods in the jail, and I know a couple of wardens, so I already got packages waiting for me. When I say packages, I mean I got clothes, books already in place, so when I come in, I’ll come in with a whole bunch of s**t. So, it’s all good.

AllHipHop.com: When did you record Black October?

Sadat X: This was done throughout the spring.

AllHipHop.com: Was it a different recording process going into the album knowing you were going away?

Sadat X: I had to do it a lot faster, really grind it out doing two to three songs a week.

AllHipHop.com: Are you already thinking about your next album? Is it going to reflect your time in jail?

Sadat X: Nah, I don’t want to make a whole jail album; nobody wants to hear that. I’m gonna reflect on certain things, but I don’t want it to be solely based on that experience.

AllHipHop.com: I was watching the video for Lord Finesse’s “Actual Facts”, and was wondering, being from the Bronx, how come you never got down with D.I.T.C.?

Sadat X: I’m affiliated with D.I.T.C., definitely. A lot of D.I.T.C. was in one area of the Bronx. They were based out of Forrest [Avenue], I was always affiliated with them — I seen them grow. I was just talking to A.G. I always talk with Diamond, O.C., and them. So yeah, I’m definitely connected with them.

AllHipHop.com: Do you find that with the global popularity that rap is enjoying now, that it’s almost unfair in a way for people such as yourself who’ve been around a long time aren’t profiting like this new generation is?

Sadat X: I take it like this: if you want to blame anybody, blame your parents for having you ten years early. Times change—you gotta change with the times. Times, change, technology changes; you grow and change with it.

Now it’s worldwide. When we first came out, people out of town didn’t have no way to see Brand Nubian; we couldn’t link to Germany — now they do. It’s just the way it is.

With seemingly everyone under the sun throwing the word “young” in front of their name or stealing the alias of an old mob boss, one could argue that the originality of rap monikers took a nosedive right along with record sales. If nothing else, you’ve got to give Xzibit credit for picking a name that’s original and actually fits. After all, an exhibit is a public showing—and if being in the rap game for over a decade and being broadcast into millions of homes doesn’t constitute a public showing, what does? Even in its more abbreviated form, “X,” which represents the unknown, the name still works. Think about it, do we really know who Xzibit is?

One minute he’s rattling off one-liners while the rest of the crew at G.A.S. is dropping $50,000 worth of custom accessories on Lawanna’s beat up VW Beetle. Is he the tattooed and khaki-clad Cali resident whose career was almost derailed by an encounter with an empty liquor bottle thrown at the speed of a baseball? Wasn’t he the one on Dr. Dre’s album, or was he lending his vocal assistance to Dee Snyder from Twisted Sister? Yes, yes and yes.

You see, if nothing else, Mr. Alvin Nathaniel Joyner is a businessman. After all, did you really think it was a coincidence that all those expensive flip-down TV’s on Pimp My Ride just so happen to be playing Xzibit videos? X is banking on the fact that everyone will see the picture clearer on October 17, when he drops his sixth studio album, Full Circle. His record label and outlook may have changed, but one thing remains the same. What you see is what you get.

AllHipHop.com: We all remember you coming into the game with King T and Tha’ Alkaholiks. What’s your relationship with your former Likwit Crew partners these days?

Xzibit: I deal with the O.G.; King T is on my new record. As far as I’m concerned he started that whole movement. He’s the one that helped start Tha’ Alkaholiks. That sound started with him and Tha’ Alkaholiks and then E-Swift stepped in and took it to another level. Those were the first guys I knew with record deals. Whatever has been put out in the media as far as them not feeling me or whatever, s**t, that is what it is. I would never say anything negative about my homies, ever. I’m not a dude that talks.

J-Ro moved over to Sweden, I haven’t talked to Rico [Tash] in a minute, and E-Swift is in Los Angeles, I believe. King T comes to kick it, though. I know his family, I know his kids and they all come hang out with me and my kids. I have close contact with King T, and he’s on my record.

AllHipHop.com: Dr. Dre, executive produced your two best selling albums. You’ve been shouted out by 50 Cent and had a cameo in 8 Mile with Eminem. Did you ever consider signing to Aftermath?

Xzibit: You’ve gotta remember, I’ve been doing work with Aftermath and Interscope since the days of “B*tch Please” and The Chronic 2001, so I was never an Aftermath artist, and I never signed to Interscope. There were talks about doing that, but with the label I was on at the time [Sony], I guess negotiations always fell through. My relationship with Dre has always been solid. My work ethic is what led to him asking me to be on Chronic 2001 and be on “B*tch Please” with Snoop. These were all calls that were made by Snoop Dogg and Dre and then that led into the relationship with Marshall and whatnot. If I ever wanted to go over there, that would be the ideal place, but it never happened.

Now, I wouldn’t want to go sign another artist deal. I feel like things I’ve done with them have spoken well and represented for what they were. I learned a lot and I’ve gained a lot from working with those guys and I feel like there’s nothing that can take away from that. I still feel like it’s important for me to stand on my own.

AllHipHop.com: People generally sign to Koch for one of two reasons: a concession that they have a smaller, yet consistently loyal fan base or as a set up for the next major label situation. Which category do you fit in?

Xzibit: I’m actually setting up to make a powerhouse centered around Open Bar Entertainment. Whether that is for a major or if I stay independent, I don’t know. I have to make that decision after we get this record out. For me, it feels better to have the brunt and the majority of work in my hands. It’s more gratifying knowing that the brunt and the majority of the profits are coming back to me.

I know that after ten years in Hip-Hop and being signed to a major, being in that loop and going through that machine, I really now have both the fan base and I still have the music the drive and desire to do [it]. But, the motivation is different, so I’ll probably stay independent.

AllHipHop.com: Did you ever feel that your former label was trying to pigeonhole you based on Pimp My Ride or your relationship with Dre?

Xzibit: Well, see, the thing with Sony is they’re a juggernaut company. What you have to understand is that [Loud] got absorbed into Sony. It’s not like I went over there and that was my ideal place to launch Xzibit. I was only familiar with Nas being on Sony, and I had never heard him say anything positive about Sony. I didn’t know what to expect. You’ve gotta remember, I had just came off of doing Restless, which sold two million out of the gate, that was my best selling record. After that we came with Man vs. Machine and Sony, thinking that they would know what to do. But, you can’t bypass the street. That’s where Xzibit fans were born and bred, and that’s where we failed. Sony knew how to get you from one to five, but they couldn’t get you to that one.

It was just a struggle and growing pains. I had never been in a position like that, and no one expected me to come out and do what I did. After that, it was sink or swim going into the corporate structure of Sony. They [absorbed] Loud and dropped everyone except me and Three-6 Mafia. That was some cold s**t. We had Big Pun, Tha Alkaholiks, Wu-Tang Clan, dead prez—that was the upstart urban label right there. We could have been there and it’s a shame that Loud Records went the way it went. They were on their way to being something and they just had no idea.

AllHipHop.com: Restless seemed easier to promote, it was like a party that we were all invited to, whereas Weapons of Mass Destruction and Man vs. Machine tackled heavier subjects such as the prison system and police brutality. Were those conscious decisions or you just growing as an artist?

Xzibit: Artistically, I try to do different things. You can’t pigeonhole and peg me as one type of MC who only does this. I live in Los Angeles, I was born in Detroit, I’ve lived in Albuquerque, and I’m well traveled. I’ve got a lot of different experiences that I try to relay through my music because I know I’m not unique in these situations. If I can connect with my listener like that, then that’s what’s up man.

Me and my homeboy were talking about it on the bus yesterday. I don’t make Hip-Hop no more; I make “Real-Hop.” There’s too many cats out here that are leading everybody with false perceptions of who they are—they’re taught by the industry. As you can see, our hood is in the trash. I’m not saying that to be preachy, or try to be T.D. Jakes and s**t, but I’ve definitely gotta put a real aspect of life out there for me. The things I talk about in my records are real and the things that I’m going through are real.

Am I the man that I was when I was 19, 20 years old? No. So I’mma tell you how I feel now. That maturity is my strength. I feel like I have the luxury to grow with my audience and they shouldn’t expect the same thing that I did on “Paparazzi” or “Foundation”. Those are things that I felt when I was that age. As I mature, as I grow and expand my horizons and my range, you can grow with me or you can just not be with it at all.

AllHipHop.com: We see that growth on songs like “Black, Brown”, which addresses the ongoing beef between Blacks and Latinos in Southern California. Did the incident from 2003 factor into making that song?

Xzibit: Definitely, man. I got hit with a Jack Daniels bottle and there was no fighting involved. It was just me and this Hispanic guy, and I guess he had a homeboy, but I didn’t see him until the end. He hit me with a [liquor] bottle like it was a f**kin’ baseball, it was about three feet away. At first I thought the dude punched me, but when I turned to say something I started spitting blood and f**kin’ glass down my shirt. There was no punches thrown, I didn’t get jumped and there wasn’t a [brawl], it was just me and him. Dude ran off after he hit me with the bottle and his homeboy came around. I guess he had a pistol, he never pulled it out, he just had his hand on it. He saw what happened, and he ran off too.

So I’m kinda like, “What do you do in that situation,” you know what I’m saying? This s**t is f**ked up. I go to the doctor, and the motherf**ker tells me, “Yo, we don’t know if you’re gonna’ heal or talk again.” That situation could’ve cost me my livelihood. It was a real intense situation, and it could have went one of two ways, ’cause my people were not happy, my n***a. I was in a position where I could either react, or sit back and see what’s going on and then react.

But, the s**t healed up, I found out that it was going to be alright. It healed how it’s gonna heal. I refuse to get plastic surgery, so f**k that. It healed how it healed, and everything’s alright. As you can see, I’ve got a film and television career after the fact. I didn’t lose my life and I didn’t have to react and do something stupid because my pride was hurt. I didn’t go and make a wrong decision out of anger. That’s where that song came from. What I got from the situation was that I was patient and calm. I was like, “Do I need to send somebody to take someone’s life? Do I need to take somebody’s life because I got hit with a bottle? Or, do I need to sit back and see that my life has taken a whole new turn?”

Now, I can do whatever the hell I want to do. That was an experience that I was supposed to learn from and a beautiful song came from it. A bangin’ concept came from it, and now I don’t have [worry] about that. That situation didn’t affect what I do. So, you’ve got to balance those situations out. If that situation had have ended with one of my family members or my son getting hurt, then that’s a reason to really go there. But, for stuff like that, I had to sit back and count the cost.

AllHipHop.com: Let’s end this on a light-hearted note. As the host of Pimp My Ride you have to come correct. Out of your collection, what’s you favorite car and what accessories do you have on it?

Xzibit: I’ve got the new Range Rover Supercharged with a complete strut kit on it. I painted it so that the whole truck is silver and only the windows are black. I put some 22-inch strut rims on it to make it complete. I like a clean look. I’ve got that and I’ve got my Bentley GT, and I just zoom around Los Angeles in those two.

AllHipHop.com: That’s not a bad way to zoom around at all. I’m pretty much set. Do you have any last words or anything for the fans?

Xzibit: October 17th, we’re gonna’ get down with Full Circle, man. I’m hungry. You can hear it in the music and I can’t wait to put this down. It feels like my first record. The motivation is different and I want to push it to the limit.

AllHipHop.com: Well, on behalf of AllHipHop.com I thank you. It was a good one, man.

Xzibit: C’mon, it’s all good man. I bulls**t you not, I really f**k with y’all tight. I really be up on y’all s**t, even the Rumor section. I’ve been up in that motherf**ka a couple of times. I just laugh about ‘em, even if they’re about me—them s**ts is crazy! Tell Illseed, he’s a crazy motherf**ka.

O ne of the beautiful things about chess, martial arts, and Hip-Hop is that at its highest levels, race does seem to fall away. You only

see the raw courage, and art in motion. International Grand Master Maurice Ashley embodies these three things, and he plays as well

as when he speaks. He is the first Black grand master and is also a product of the Hip-Hop generation. In this interview, Maurice discusses

how he began his journey as a chess player. He tells of how he clashed with GZA and Will Smith on the 64 and squares, and who would come out ahead in his opinion. The mysteries of chessboxin’ are revealed in this interview between the Bishop and the King. Check

AllHipHop.com: So, what does it take to become a grand master in chess? What do you have to do?

Maurice Ashley: You have to get a performance record of 2600 in 25 games. Now, what does that mean? You have to play in different international tournaments. There are various masters and international grand masters there. You have to perform at a certain level against that crowd. There is a specific kind of rating in chess. The best players are usually ranked over 2600. Garry Kasparov was the highest rated player of all times and he was rated at 2851 at his peak. But 2600 is the top 100 players in the world.

In order to become a grand master, you have to perform at that level of ability not once, but generally speaking, three times. Because most tournaments are nine rounds each. You have to do it in three tournaments. You literally play like one of the best in order to be given the title. If you can do that three times, you are given the title.

AllHipHop.com: Who was your last match against for you to get the title and how nervous were you?

Maurice Ashley: The gentleman was a guy from Romania, Adrian Negulescu. He was an international master. That game I was incredibly

nervous. I went into the game, and in the middle of the game, everything changed. Around move 14 I realized, “It’s all good. I just need to settle in and play.” I was able to play very calmly, very coolly and just play.

For that kind of important game, you wouldn’t think hat I could be calm throughout. It just so happened that I was very calm. My opponent did not know that game would give me the title. He just thought it was a regular chess game. But my friends knew, and a couple of people around me knew. So, after the game, he was like, “Why are you so happy”? I was like, “I just got my title.” He said, “Oh, wow.” He was cool about the game. Chess players are real sportsmen. It was a good game… he treated it with respect.

AllHipHop.com: Few people see the relationship between Hip-Hop and chess. When did you start seeing it?

Maurice Ashley: Well I’m old enough to be at the beginning of Hip-Hop. I came [to the United States from Jamaica] in 1978. Hip-Hop didn’t start until Sugar Hill [Records] blew up. That was about 1980, maybe ’79. I was of course a Bob Marley fan first. I grew up where Reggae was playin’ on the streets everyday. That kinda music was a part of my life on a regular basis. When I came here, Reggae wasn’t what it is now. It was a Jamaican

phenomenon. It wasn’t what it is now, with Sean Paul and crew got things to where they are today.

Chess and Hip-Hop definitely have elements that intertwined. One of those

things is creativity. The greatest chess players are creative. Of course there are some calculations that have to be made. There is skill

involved, much like there is skill involved Hip-Hop. But it is not the mathematical that separate the greatest players, it’s the creativity.

It’s the ability to change with the environment. Having the ability to deal with any situation hat confront you no matter what the

danger – to be able to over come. To stay cool under all pressure. That’s the real mark of a champion in chess.

AllHipHop.com: I know that you have mentored the GZA and Will Smith from time to time on chess strategies…

Maurice Ashley: VIBE was doing an article on the connection between chess and Hip-Hop. So, they linked us together. In the end, they only

explored the Hip-Hop side, and just did the article with GZA. But we found out we had to do a photo shoot together. We finally ended up meeting. We hung out at a chess club in Brooklyn, and I showed them some stuff.

AllHipHop.com: What did you think of GZA’s game and what have you helped him develop?

Maurice Ashley: Well, I was very surprised by his game. Considering he has never played a tournament in his life, he plays like a tournament

player. The problem he has is he does not have the long foundation one needs to avoid certain categories of mistakes. I was stunned

to hear that he had not read many chess books. What happened was, he just played.

Through practice he developed a lot of ideas on his own. When Wu-Tang fights, they get down. Their strength is mathematical-

tactical. It’s like street fighting. But street fighting does not work against a polished boxer. There are tremendous limits, and they will

show up . As the game goes on, sooner or later you are going to make a mistake.

AllHipHop.com: Tell me about Will Smith…

Maurice Ashley: I was blessed to meet him. He saw me when I was first getting attention for being the first African American grand master, back

in 1999. He reached out as did other stars, Wynton Marsalis, Bill Cosby… I met quite a few people, because they understood the

significance of a brother making it in that kind of field.

I met with [Will] briefly at a studio. But I could only stay a few minutes because I had my young four-year-old daughter with me.

I did not hook up with him again until the next year. His wife’s assistant called me and said that his wife wanted to surprise him on

Valentine’s Day. She wanted to give him a lesson with a grand master and asked could I come.

When came in the room he was like, “Whoa, what’s going on?” She was like, “Happy Valentines Day.” We played for like three hours. He has a very good game. He had been playing a while, and he reads. I would think that he would do better against GZA if they rumbled because his game has less holes in it.

AllHipHop.com: Like that?

Maurice Ashley: Will’s game has a little bit more polish to it. You gotta be careful with Will.

AllHipHop.com: In the movie Searching for Bobby Fischer, there is the theme of balancing the street hustler’s chess style [played by Lawrence

Fishbourne] and his classical chess teacher [played by Ben Kingsley]. What are the strengths and weakness of both kind of players?

Maurice Ashley: I think it goes back to the same concepts I mentioned earlier. The classically trained player knows the history, knows that which

has occurred in the past, knows what is proven. Because you can always draw on the classics to draw on a problem as you face it. The classics are tremendously important and provide the foundation of what it is you need to be successful.

However, something the classical player might lack, is that spontaneity. That innovative style. The ability to handle chaos. Because chaos has no rules.

AllHipHop.com: It has sublime rules.

Maurice Ashley: Well you have chaos theory and the butterfly effect and all that stuff…It’s not an easily quantifiable set of rules that you can say

“Well, stuff hits the fan this is what you do.” [Laughs]

The classically trained player might get confused in those situations, while the street player knows all about those situations. Knows all about life getting wild. Sometimes you don’t have money to pay the rent. You might have to go to Mikey D’s to get that next meal, or hustle up to get a drink.

AllHipHop.com: In the chess movie Fresh, which features Samuel L. Jackson, there is a scene where Jackson’s character sits in a trailer with his

son. He has photos of all these various chess greats. Bruce Pandolfini, Bobby Fischer, and others. He starts talking about as good as

a lot of these guys might be that with a chess clock- they cannot hang. That the pressure of a timed game proves the toughness of the

mind. How does a clock change the nature of the game?

Maurice Ashley: Control becomes a real issue. Some people think lightening quick and can control a game all the way through – even at the five-minute mark. But it’s almost impossible to do. Many more situations occur that force you to relay on intuition than calculation. That kind of intuition does change the game dramatically. People who are more used

to thinking fast on their feet play better clock chess, or what’s known as “speed chess” than they will over the board- which is a

slower version. You can have a player who will crunch you with no clock who will have trouble against you on the clock. Because

that person cannot check your ideas with a thorough search.

A lot of street players when they get into tournaments, they have failed. They sometimes don’t do well, because they don’t have the

dedication. They don’t have the patience for sitting at the boards for a long period of time.

Adisa Banjoko is the author of “Lyrical Swords Vol. 2: Westside Rebellion”. To download an ebook today visit

www.lyricalswords.com.